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#1
And wonder why are you looking at a $3000+ amp and a couple more grand in gear when your current budget rig slaughters 3/4's of the bands out there lol

It hit me today, I was listening to a band and there metal tone was decent but not mind blowing and i actually preferred my tone over theres. But yet there famous im not. Then I got to thinking hell Static X has one of the worst tones on the planet yet he is rich and famous. Then I think to myself do I really need a Bogner Uberschall or Engl Powerball or my uber GAS Herbert. And the answer is HELL YES I want the best and wont rest until I have the perfect tone... lol

Just wondering what everyone else thinks about mainstream bands and how there tone compares to yours. Honestly I dont see how some of these bands get away with sounding the way they do.
#2
i dislike most off the bands today, i found most songs sound alike, like the rap or hip-hop and the poor excuses for punk bands. i love the tone of the 60s, the tube amps and stuff

i find the tone today isnt good, all the presence and middle is dropped from the amps and their guitars are all tuned to drop Z flat..

but don't listen to me, I'm special
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#3
I'm more of a classic rock kind of guy, but most stuff on the radio sounds alright. Its harder for me to say that I think my tone is better when it's not the same.

I do wonder how dimebag got away with his tone, and why people like it.
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#4
I always try to get the best tone I can with what I have, but more and more I hear things happening to guitar tones that shouldn't. I hear people scooping thier mids AND gains, which is really wierd. Anyway, yeah. I think that about alot of bands that are like...sacred to most people. Secretly, I think Zakk Wylde's tone is like...bad.
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#5
Quote by Kevin Saale
I'm more of a classic rock kind of guy, but most stuff on the radio sounds alright. Its harder for me to say that I think my tone is better when it's not the same.

I do wonder how dimebag got away with his tone, and why people like it.



I didn't.
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#6
Yeah but, their tones sell. Your's don't.

Most GREAT musicians don't make good money. Just cause you make money for what you do, doesn't mean you're good at it. It just sells.
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#8
Quote by 451F
I always try to get the best tone I can with what I have, but more and more I hear things happening to guitar tones that shouldn't. I hear people scooping thier mids AND gains, which is really wierd. Anyway, yeah. I think that about alot of bands that are like...sacred to most people. Secretly, I think Zakk Wylde's tone is like...bad.


well thats your oppinion
zakk's tone were great back in the days you know
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#9
I hate paul gilbert's tone and he's... good o_o
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#10
Having great tone and such isn't inclusive with being talented at WRITING music. People forget that. You can be as good as you want and you can be a great session musician. But, to be famous you need talented writing ability.

Obviously there's exceptions, but that's just the case. I think this is more the case in slightly under the radar music scenes. Not mainstream, but filling 1-4000 size venues.
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#11
This is a stupid argument. It's like claiming you're a better artist than Picasso because you prefer your paints.

It's about the big picture.
#12
Quote by Kurapica
Having great tone and such isn't inclusive with being talented at WRITING music. People forget that. You can be as good as you want and you can be a great session musician. But, to be famous you need talented writing ability.

Obviously there's exceptions, but that's just the case. I think this is more the case in slightly under the radar music scenes. Not mainstream, but filling 1-4000 size venues.


Theres also the exact opposite. Bands that write great music and insane riffs but because of there gear it sounds like trash. Writing ability can play a part in tone but it isnt what really makes the tone if you know what I mean. Example I've heard some really bad riffs, really simple riffs and songs but the tone sounds spot on so I love to listen to them.
#13
Quote by smb
This is a stupid argument. It's like claiming you're a better artist than Picasso because you prefer your paints.

It's about the big picture.


I think what IP is saying is how can they spend so much money on gear and not have a good tone.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#14
Quote by Kevin Saale
I think what IP is saying is how can they spend so much money on gear and not have a good tone.
Has he been on youtube lately? There's a million kids with Gibsons etc that sound like crap. It's not hard to have good tools but still produce rubbish.

Major label music is always compressed to hell anyway, which doesn't do anything for the tone.
#15
Quote by IbanezPsycho
Theres also the exact opposite. Bands that write great music and insane riffs but because of there gear it sounds like trash. Writing ability can play a part in tone but it isnt what really makes the tone if you know what I mean. Example I've heard some really bad riffs, really simple riffs and songs but the tone sounds spot on so I love to listen to them.


I'm not being argumentative, just curious here...but which bands have great music but trash sound? None spring to mind for me, but maybe you know some.

My mate uses quite bad equipment but because he's a good guitarist, he still sounds great. He plays an Epi SG through a Peavey SS amp with a Boss DS1. Cheap gear, sounds great when he plays it.
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#16
Quote by smb
This is a stupid argument. It's like claiming you're a better artist than Picasso because you prefer your paints.

It's about the big picture.


Honestly I hate Picasso and it still baffles how a painting a 2 year old can do is worth millions... And theres alot better artists that use finger paints that curse god at the to this day because of him lol
#17
Quote by IbanezPsycho
Honestly I hate Picasso and it still baffles how a painting a 2 year old can do is worth millions... And theres alot better artists that use finger paints that curse god at the to this day because of him lol


Have you ever seen early Picasso?

Wow, way off thread.
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#18
Quote by Kurapica
I'm not being argumentative, just curious here...but which bands have great music but trash sound? None spring to mind for me, but maybe you know some.

My mate uses quite bad equipment but because he's a good guitarist, he still sounds great. He plays an Epi SG through a Peavey SS amp with a Boss DS1. Cheap gear, sounds great when he plays it.


Most of the bands are metal bands were you can hear the riff and beat but the amps distortion just isnt up to par. To muddy, to harsh , to scooped, to much gain, to little gain or just a bad tone altogether. Its almost like they dont even care they sit there and write these great riffs and songs day to day then go in to the studio and use whatevers there. Like you can tell its there first time using a Recto in the studio and just set it up like they would there 6505 they use live.

Thats the flip side of things as well some people need a Bogner to sound good and some can pull it off with a cheap gutiar, ss amp and boss ds1.
#19
Quote by Kurapica
Have you ever seen early Picasso?

Wow, way off thread.


Yes, studied alot of artists I was going to actually be an artist for a living

And that said never liked him never will lol...
#20
Actually, most live shows I've been to seemed to sound pretty good. If there was a problem, it was more in the acoustics of the venue, or the overall mix more than someone's individual tone. What really bothers me is modern studio recording techniques. Most of the big label bands I've heard in the last 10 years or so sound so compressed and muddy in the studio. It's like the producer is just trying to squash everything and fill every gap in a record. There's no empty space to be found anywhere, and no dynamics, so everything just sounds like the same crap from beginning to end. A good example would be if you listen to Chevelle's Point #1, and then switch over to This Type of Thinking. Or Switchfoot's Legend of Chin, which was probably recorded in a very small studio with very little equipment and editing, and then their last two albums, which just sound so boring and flat by comparison. I blame the EQing and mixing on the albums more than the artists themselves, but that just applies to studio work.
#22
Quote by Ze_Metal
Who listens to mainstream music. Psh.


Anyone who doesn't think that the quality of music is always directly related to how few fans they have.
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#23
Also to clear up a little confusion pretty much any remotely popular metal band im lumping in as mainstream because pretty much 98% of the population of metal bands never get air time. So that would pretty much exclude a whole genre and 50 sub genre's lol
#24
Not to be rude, but im sick of dudes bashing aritst tone. Any hack can go out and buy $3000 amps and guitars, but the reason Wayne static is famous is that he has that special word called talent. Its a very miniscule point that he has bad tone. Dimebag had bad tone, and he is a legend. No one goes around saying Gosh that dime was a great shredder, but damn he had bad tone.

Real tone comes from the soal and fingers. Not wallets

This thread should be closed.
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Last edited by Ubershall404 at Sep 3, 2008,
#25
Quote by smb
This is a stupid argument. It's like claiming you're a better artist than Picasso because you prefer your paints.

It's about the big picture.



Thank you.
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#26
Quote by Ubershall404
Not to be rude, but im sick of dudes bashing aritst tone. Any hack can go out and buy $3000 amps and guitars, but the reason Wayne static is famous is that he has that special word called talent. Its a very miniscule point that he has bad tone. Dimebag had bad tone, and he is a legend. No one goes around saying Gosh that dime was a great shredder, but damn he had bad tone.

Real tone comes from the soal and fingers. Not wallets

This thread should be closed.


Tone does NOT just come from the fingers. That's like saying some amazing player playing through a B. C. Rich Starter Pack Amp with the gain and volume on max and mids scooped will sound just as good, if not better than the okay guitarist with a Two-Rock amp and Ibanez Custom Shop guitar.

Sure, he'll PLAY better - but he won't SOUND better. Mojo does not affect tone.

Wayne Static's gear doesn't cost 3 grand, either - it costs alot less. MG100HDFX + cab + Epiphone guitar != even $1500. And again, if it were such a miniscule point, why would we all notice it? And on Dime, he's dead. Dead artists are worshiped often regardless of their work (see Hendrix, Freddy Mercury, Bob Marley, Kurt Cobain, Stevie Ray Vaughn, et al) As well, many people comment on Dime's tone. Search the forums.

Talent is not necessarily something that comes from the artist - "talent" (namely, marketability) can be cultivated and engineered by record labels. Simply because an artist sells doesn't mean they're any good - it just means people like them. Enjoying something does not magically make it awesome. If I said I liked to eat dog turds and that caught on as a trend and suddenly the whole world liked eating dog turds, would it be cool?

EDIT: ...and then I noticed this is coming from a guy with a Framus Cobra. If tone really didn't matter as much as you say, why would you be playing on such a great amp?
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#27
also listening to records, alot of newer bands use software to simulate amps..... just doesn't work out all that great, no big dynamics/nuances of the real amp
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#28
my only thought is this.

it is amazing to some degree because bands can get popular for different reasons as we all know. Then the endorsements and money come in and they buy whatever because it was expensive but their playing or talent may not be all that good to begin with - hence poor tone.

ps. i do see a lot of mainstream metal on the air and in the top charts.

pss. tone is subjective and i don't see a problem with your thread.
#29
i hate the human abstract's rhythm tone. i love the band though.
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#30
Have you guys, for once, understand that tone is purely subjective, and yes, I do mean that some people may actually find chainsaw pleasureable. Just like woman: some people hate dolled up porn stars with big fake breast, some like it (or rather, don't care as long as they have huge melons). In fact, such comparison is exactly perfect for what actually are good tone and what people perceived as good tone.
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#31
How bout this most of the people listening to mainstream music are tone deaf, and prefer drum tracks and computerized basslines over live music
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#33
I don't think I've ever heard a big name band with actually bad tone maybe you didnt like it but that's your preference. Feel free to prove me wrong though..... An even if there tone wasnt that great its still more about how you play the instrument and even more importantly the things you write. You can play every Steve Vai song ever written and it won't get you anywhere unless you yourself can write good songs that people like aswell.(Or ofcourse if your rich with connections and have the perfect mainstream image then you can get other people to write you songs well you just play then and steal the spotlight) Well if you still think that you should be signed instead of those other artists then go for it. But its gonna take loads of time, persistence and patience because as soon as you doubt you''ll make it you might aswell have already given up.....
#34
funny thing i find is that bands which i dislike often have decent, if not downright good, tone, while more modern bands, whose songs I do like, often have crappy tone. interesting.
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#35
There are very few mainstream artists to whom I listen, mainly because none of them play the kind of music I want to hear. Derek Trucks, the White Stripes, the Black Keys and Gov't Mule are probably the main ones to whom I listen that get any notice at all, and they all have exceptional tone, save maybe the White Stripes. Oh, and I listen to a lot of RATM, and Tom Morello has great tone.


Two things about tone and gear: Good tone is 100% subjective, and a good musician can make any gear sound good.

Tone IS in the hands of the musician, because of the nuances of their playing and their ears. If they hear something they don't like, they are going to change it. And they are going to work with the sound that they are getting to exploit the good qualities to make it work.

The thing about having good gear, though, is that it makes it easier to achieve what works musically.

I have a general philosophic problem with most mainstream 'artists' ( ), anyway
#36
I thought Picasso had great tone.
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#37
Quote by gregs1020
I thought Picasso had great tone.

I thought it was scooped
#38
You know, there are only a handful of bands I've listened to where their tone was so great that I noticed it. Otherwise, 99 percent of the time, I'm listening to the composition and the playing. Tone is generally something only guitarists are concerned with, not music listeners.
#39
you dont think you just have a crappy radio?
Get off this damn forum and play your damn guitar.
#40
I like the tone of guitars on TWs albums, it's like all so lo-fi, clipped and cool. And I like the tone on some of Slipknots songs, and that's it. On "Violet Hill" by Coldplay the tone is very cool too. But yes, most band have terrible tone.
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