#1
Good day.

Why is complex and technically demanding classical music like Chopin and Paganini appreciated for its show of virtuosity, but classically-influenced shred guitar is dismissed as soulless wankery?

Please explain without flaming.
#2
Quote by sashki
Good day.

Why is complex and technically demanding classical music like Chopin and Paganini appreciated for its show of virtuosity,


It's more than that... listen to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=825Ekk1u3mQ&feature=related

It's not all complex and technically demanding. And guitar wanking's horrible in general.
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#3
Quote by sashki
Good day.

Why is complex and technically demanding classical music like Chopin and Paganini appreciated for its show of virtuosity, but classically-influenced shred guitar is dismissed as soulless wankery?

Please explain without flaming.


Probably because what gives a guitar feeling is really the bending of notes which could not be done on other instruments.
#4
valid point. what the hell is flight of the bumble bee? biggest wank filled piece of crap ever, but people love it
#5
I don't think you will get many serious replies. I'll sum up any replies you could possibly get.

A) People that say "shred sux" either because they can't play it, wish they could play it, don't have the attention span or do not like it.

B) Classical music wannabes quoting someone else saying it could never compare to "classical" music.

C) People who like it and who can see positives in most styles of music, and the crossover of genres.

D) People telling you go elsewhere or reporting the thread.

--

Personally I love the proms, Langlang and his 9year old student were amazing... classical when I hear it, listen to it... Love Malmsteens efforts, Becker.. check out Paul Gilberts new album.
#6
Quote by Kensai
It's not all complex and technically demanding. And guitar wanking's horrible in general.


But... I love fapping with my guitar.



Srsly though, Classical shred has a certain "cleanliness" and maturity to it that guitar shred sometimes lacks. A lot of guitar shred is good, when done right. Or so I think.
Quote by denizenz
I'll logic you right in the thyroid.

Art & Lutherie
#7
Guitar wankery that isn't musical sucks, of course. But stuff like Yngwie Malmsteen (sorry, first one I could think of) is technically demanding, but still musical. He uses scales, chord changes, arpeggios, plays melodies with various ornamentations.
Quote by darkstar2466
But... I love fapping with my guitar.



Srsly though, Classical shred has a certain "cleanliness" and maturity to it that guitar shred sometimes lacks. A lot of guitar shred is good, when done right. Or so I think.

This leads us to the stereotype that guitar music is either satanic, or disposable teenage junk. Shredders know as much music theory as the average classical composer. What makes them different?
Quote by ViperScale
Probably because what gives a guitar feeling is really the bending of notes which could not be done on other instruments.

Because a well placed sequence of agressively picked notes conveys no emotion whatsoever? I agree that bends and vibrato are very expressive, but so are texture changes due to picking, harmonics and stuff. They're all valid techniques.
Last edited by sashki at Sep 9, 2008,
#8
Quote by Jackolas

A) People that say "shred sux" either because they can't play it, wish they could play it, don't have the attention span or do not like it.



I don't totally dislike shredding, but songs that are nothing but shredding instrumentals i found over time i just skipped on my ipod random while other instrumentals I did not. The major instrumentals i have on my ipod are vai, satch, and andy timmons, and some other random shredders (well at one time). I find that vai / satch i skip probably half the time, andy timmons stuff i tend to listen to 80-90% of the time, and the pure shredders i have skipped on shuffle so i can just pick to listen to for more scholarly purpose of learning to play.

I think shredding is funner to play then to listen to.
#9
Classical shred is cliche. It was over done to death in the 80's and the novelty is long worn off. It's like early 90's rap. People got sick of it.

These days I just don't enjoy listening to it. I love classical music and I love metal ... the fusion was a great experiment and it worked, but it got very boring after a while and now it's old, easy and safe. If you've heard one wanker play a metal version of a classical tune you've heard them all. It's no longer original and it's no longer impressive. Search for Canon on Youtube and you'll get thousands of guitarists wanking away at it. Let's try something new.
#12
Quote by sashki
What if it's not neoclassical? Like, say, John Petrucci. He doesn't sound like he's copying Bach. He does his own thing.


I thought neoclassical was when they created new-classical aka they aren't copying a old piece.
#13
Neoclassical gets real old real fast.
Quote by denizenz
I'll logic you right in the thyroid.

Art & Lutherie
#14
Who cares if people dislike shred. I don't know about you guys but I play guitar for the challenge, and most of all the fun. Sometimes I look at someone playing punk and I am about to get down on them for how easy it is, but then I look at how much fun they are having, and I realize that that is exactly why I play. To have fun and be expressive. Don't get down on shred if you dont like it, as long as you are playing it for fun and not to make it look like you have a big musical ****, I'm all for it!
#15
It's because people have the idea that having fun playing your instrument is somehow unacceptable. Most people that bash shred do so because they can't do so, and are jealous.

Either that or they play blues and have the idea that playing as few notes as possible per bar is the best show of talent. Personally I think blues has much more guitar wankery than shred.

Shred that has no purpose does get annoying. Music should always say something. Complicated words placed next to each other do nothing but sound complicated yet annoying. Words placed together with meaning behind them can make the most beautiful poetry on earth.
ALWAYS

WANNA BE WITH YOU,
MAKE BELIEV
E WITH YOU,
AND L
IVE IN HARMONY, HARMONY,



OH, LOOVE!
#16
Neoclassical stuff like Yngwie is boring because quite seriously, Yngwie just wanks on the harmonic minor really fast. Chopin's music is more complex and so doesn't get boring. A good example of entertaining music that uses shred is Guthrie Govan, though he's jazz, not classical.

This is all in my humble opinion of course.
Quote by SlinkyBlue
I remember when I was really young, I had a wet dream in which i was being dragged along an urban countryside by a pickup truck.

Don't ask me I have no idea how the hell it happened.




To Me:

Quote by Son.Of.TheViper

I love you
#17
Quote by darkstar2466
But... I love fapping with my guitar.



Srsly though, Classical shred has a certain "cleanliness" and maturity to it that guitar shred sometimes lacks. A lot of guitar shred is good, when done right. Or so I think.


I let my guitar watch me masturbate.
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#18
Quote by Kensai
I let my guitar watch me masturbate.


I watch my guitar masturbate.


Which I masturbate to.
Quote by SlinkyBlue
I remember when I was really young, I had a wet dream in which i was being dragged along an urban countryside by a pickup truck.

Don't ask me I have no idea how the hell it happened.




To Me:

Quote by Son.Of.TheViper

I love you
#19
Quote by sashki
Good day.

Why is complex and technically demanding classical music like Chopin and Paganini appreciated for its show of virtuosity, but classically-influenced shred guitar is dismissed as soulless wankery?

Please explain without flaming.



Depends which shred guitarists you're talking about.

Because classical music is the paramount of music in terms of complexity, they use things like polyrhythms, polychords, atonal voicings and scale mixing in addition to their amazing techniques.
hue
#20
Quote by sock_demon
Depends which shred guitarists you're talking about.

Because classical music is the paramount of music in terms of complexity, they use things like polyrhythms, polychords, atonal voicings and scale mixing in addition to their amazing techniques.

...So does the average progressive metal guitarist.