#1
Hello everyone. First time poster, long time reader.

I recently bought an ISP Decimator ProRack G, to help me get rid of squealing feedback and noise. I have the worst feedback problem ever, and read (and heard soundclips) that made me believe this unit would help.

I read the manual and plugged the Decimator into my FX Loop, and made sure that everything is set up correctly (and it is). But it does nothing! There is no change in my sound, no affect on the feedback etc whatsoever. I've tried adjusting the settings every which way, but to no avail. And it is a fat downer when you pay around 500 euro for the best noise reduction unit there is, and nothing happens...

My rig, if that is of consequence here:

Engl Savage 120 (G-Major and Decimator ProRack G in FX Loop)
Engl Pro 4x12
Boss TU-2 and MXR Smartgate pedals between guitar and amp input.
#2
Are you sure it's on? New battery? Try putting it in front of your guitar. Otherwise, give it back to the store and demand a change of unit.
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#4
Welcome,

That's very odd. Are you sure you've got it set up right?

Take the pedals and g-major out of the signal. Turn the ENGLs onboard noise gate off. Path should be:

Guitar -> Decimator channel 1 input, Decimator ch1 send -> amp input
Amp FX loop send -> Decimator channel 2 input, Decimator ch2 send -> amp FX loop return

When you add your G-major back in, put it in between the decimator ch2 send and the amp FX loop return. If you have it before the decimator ch 2, you will find that quiet delay repeats are silenced.

With the amp turned on, and guitar plugged in, push each "out/in" switch so that the little red LED is illuminated next to each, and turn the threshold knobs to full. There should be no sound coming from your amp. The three vertical red LEDs next to each threshold knob should be illuminated. Leave the filter tracking knob set as far anti-clockwise as it will go. If you are getting background hum from the amp (hum, not feedback and hiss), experiment with the ground lift switches as the back.

If you're not getting any noise reduction at this stage, there is something wrong with your Decimator. Get in touch with iSP and find out what could be the problem, and make sure you get a replacement if necessary. The Decimator series of products are the best noise reducers/gates out there, and the ProRackG is the top of the pile. It's a shame if yours is faulty, but don't go elsewhere until you've tried one working properly.

Quote by Horlicks
Turn the FX loop to series, instead of bypass or parallel


True. Though I'd imagine he was using a serial loop for the G-major anyway..
Last edited by Nolly at Sep 11, 2008,
#5
Quote by Nolly

True. Though I'd imagine he was using a serial loop for the G-major anyway..

Really? I tend to use parallel with all my time-based effects, considering you usually don't want distortion ruining your delay.
#6
Thanks for the swift replies! I will go over the setup once more. A few pointers though:

* The Savage 120 does not have an onboard noise gate.

* The Savage 120 does not have an option to switch FX Loop between parallell and serial.

* Yes, I am sure the ISP is on. The led's all light up, even the ones that show the amount of reduction taking place. But soundwise - it does nothing.

* I am very sure the ISP unit is not faulty. Whatever the problem is, it's not in the Decimator.

And yes, this is really ****en wierd!
#7
Oh sorry, the Savage DOES have a control for switching the master FX Loop between serial/parallell. At least sort of. There is a knob that if turned full counterclockwise feeds dry signal (parallell) and if turned full clockwise feeds only wet signal (serial). I usually have it set in the middle. I'll try changing this as well.
#8
Quote by Horlicks
Really? I tend to use parallel with all my time-based effects, considering you usually don't want distortion ruining your delay.

? Not sure that makes sense. Running a parallel loop at 100% mix should have the same effect as using a serial loop, surely?

Quote by Thaumiel
Oh sorry, the Savage DOES have a control for switching the master FX Loop between serial/parallell. At least sort of. There is a knob that if turned full counterclockwise feeds dry signal (parallell) and if turned full clockwise feeds only wet signal (serial). I usually have it set in the middle. I'll try changing this as well.


Yes, definitely have that fully clockwise. Sounds like the iSP is working, just only gating a portion of the signal. Half the signal is passing through unprocessed, and that could be the cause of your feedback woes. If that has been the case, you'll notice your G-major effects will be sounding far far better as well.
Last edited by Nolly at Sep 11, 2008,
#9
Nolly: Here's hoping! Man, if everything worked out great and the feedback squeal and hum disappeared I think I'd probably cry from happiness.

Also. my Decimator doesn't have ground lift switches. It is the ProRack G, but not the stereo mod-version.

Again, thanks for the help. I'll try all these (and more) tricks out in the rehearsal space tomorrow and report back. If you don't hear from me it probably means that nothing worked and I drove the rig and myself into a lake.
#10
Quote by Thaumiel
Nolly: Here's hoping! Man, if everything worked out great and the feedback squeal and hum disappeared I think I'd probably cry from happiness.

Also. my Decimator doesn't have ground lift switches. It is the ProRack G, but not the stereo mod-version.

Again, thanks for the help. I'll try all these (and more) tricks out in the rehearsal space tomorrow and report back. If you don't hear from me it probably means that nothing worked and I drove the rig and myself into a lake.


Hope everything works out mate!

FWIW, my ProRackG isn't the stereo version either, but it does have ground lift switches. They're on the back panel.
#11
I actually had something very similiar to what your describing happen to me with the G String pedal. I came across a strange solution for it too. I found that having TWO regular Decimator pedals, one for the loop, one for in front, worked better than the G String. It seems like the tonal variation(s)(settings) were different for the loop and for the guitar. The loop or MY loop actually required MUCH less noise reduction than my guitar side. This sounds illogical, and I realize that. But if you tried it, you'd hear EXACTLY what I mean. Having two seperate control knobs simply worked better for ME.
#12
Quote by TheEsupremacy
I actually had something very similiar to what your describing happen to me with the G String pedal. I came across a strange solution for it too. I found that having TWO regular Decimator pedals, one for the loop, one for in front, worked better than the G String. It seems like the tonal variation(s)(settings) were different for the loop and for the guitar. The loop or MY loop actually required MUCH less noise reduction than my guitar side. This sounds illogical, and I realize that. But if you tried it, you'd hear EXACTLY what I mean. Having two seperate control knobs simply worked better for ME.


Understandable. The ProRack has two seperate threshold controls for that very reason
Last edited by Nolly at Sep 11, 2008,
#13
Quote by Nolly
Hope everything works out mate!

FWIW, my ProRackG isn't the stereo version either, but it does have ground lift switches. They're on the back panel.


That'll be because your have the latest version, and I don't.
#14
Quote by Nolly
Understandable. The ProRack has two seperate threshold controls for that very reason

Never seen the rackmount version but thank you for posting that because I felt dumb trying to explain to everybody why that works better for me.
#15
Quote by Thaumiel
Oh sorry, the Savage DOES have a control for switching the master FX Loop between serial/parallell. At least sort of. There is a knob that if turned full counterclockwise feeds dry signal (parallell) and if turned full clockwise feeds only wet signal (serial). I usually have it set in the middle. I'll try changing this as well.


definitely do that. i have a savage se, and that knob does the same thing as a switch between series and parallel.

not too sure about the decimator problem, i only have the pedal... good luck though, nolly normally knows what he's talking about.
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#16
Quote by TheEsupremacy
I actually had something very similiar to what your describing happen to me with the G String pedal. I came across a strange solution for it too. I found that having TWO regular Decimator pedals, one for the loop, one for in front, worked better than the G String. It seems like the tonal variation(s)(settings) were different for the loop and for the guitar. The loop or MY loop actually required MUCH less noise reduction than my guitar side. This sounds illogical, and I realize that. But if you tried it, you'd hear EXACTLY what I mean. Having two seperate control knobs simply worked better for ME.


that is very interesting. i already have one decimator, and then the g-string came out. From what you've said, there's probably not much point in getting the g-string, and possibly more point in just getting another decimator for the loop (if i ever decide i need that much noise reduction). Thanks!
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#17
Quote by Dave_Mc
that is very interesting. i already have one decimator, and then the g-string came out. From what you've said, there's probably not much point in getting the g-string, and possibly more point in just getting another decimator for the loop (if i ever decide i need that much noise reduction). Thanks!

No problem. I really think the two pedals worked better than the one G String. The only downside is it costs just a tad more than one G String pedal. It seem like with only one threshhold knob it either took too much away from the guitar OR the loop. For instance, my loop barely produces any noise so I have that eq'd @ around 8 o'clock, but for my guitar, it makes more noise so that is eq'd @ around 10 or 11 o'clock. Kinda strange, but you understand what I mean I hope.
#18
On the G-string vs twin decimator debate:

Basically, I believe it comes down to your setup. For example, I'm going to guess that TheEsupremacy boosts the front end of his 6505 with the Maxon or OCD, probably creating a more than normal level of hiss at the front end of the amp, while the hiss created in the preamp section is relatively little. If I'm right, then it seems logical that the same level of gating at both points (as per the G-string) will be pretty inefficient.
Perhaps for someone else's setup, they may find that the G-string works perfectly well; many people have specifically commented on how effective it is, despite it's single threshold control.

I guess the only way to find out is to try one. If it works satisfactorily, you save yourself a little cash, and end up with a neater rig.

Or buy the ProRack.

Quote by Dave_Mc
nolly normally knows what he's talking about.


#19
Quote by Nolly
On the G-string vs twin decimator debate:

Basically, I believe it comes down to your setup. For example, I'm going to guess that TheEsupremacy boosts the front end of his 6505 with the Maxon or OCD, probably creating a more than normal level of hiss at the front end of the amp, while the hiss created in the preamp section is relatively little. If I'm right, then it seems logical that the same level of gating at both points (as per the G-string) will be pretty inefficient.
Perhaps for someone else's setup, they may find that the G-string works perfectly well; many people have specifically commented on how effective it is, despite it's single threshold control.

I guess the only way to find out is to try one. If it works satisfactorily, you save yourself a little cash, and end up with a neater rig.

Or buy the ProRack.




That's what I was trying to say. Thank you.
#21
Quote by TheEsupremacy
No problem. I really think the two pedals worked better than the one G String. The only downside is it costs just a tad more than one G String pedal. It seem like with only one threshhold knob it either took too much away from the guitar OR the loop. For instance, my loop barely produces any noise so I have that eq'd @ around 8 o'clock, but for my guitar, it makes more noise so that is eq'd @ around 10 or 11 o'clock. Kinda strange, but you understand what I mean I hope.


yeah, i do, thanks. i run my decimator in front of the amp, and it kills all the noise i need, except when i run my highest gain channel, where i could use a little more noise reduction (which more or less ties in with what you're saying). my amp has two loops too, so i could stick the second decimator in the loop for my high gain channel(s).

also, your point about the g-string being marginally cheaper isn't really a problem for me, considering i already have one decimator (though obviously it's worth considering if you have no noise gate and are trying to decide what to go for).

big problem now is in deciding whether to suck it up and get the rack-mount version (which is unlikely since i know nothing about racks, and have no rack equipment so i'd have to buy a load of other stuff too), or get a second decimator (or more likely, just do nothing, lol).

Thanks!

Quote by Nolly
On the G-string vs twin decimator debate:

Basically, I believe it comes down to your setup. For example, I'm going to guess that TheEsupremacy boosts the front end of his 6505 with the Maxon or OCD, probably creating a more than normal level of hiss at the front end of the amp, while the hiss created in the preamp section is relatively little. If I'm right, then it seems logical that the same level of gating at both points (as per the G-string) will be pretty inefficient.
Perhaps for someone else's setup, they may find that the G-string works perfectly well; many people have specifically commented on how effective it is, despite it's single threshold control.

I guess the only way to find out is to try one. If it works satisfactorily, you save yourself a little cash, and end up with a neater rig.

Or buy the ProRack.






i don't run a boost, by the way- but even still, with the decimator out in front, it cuts most of the noise i'd need for some reason.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#22
Ok, reporting back. I have now achieved perfection. The rig is dead ****en silent when I'm not playing and it sounds amazing. I am really stunned at how good this unit is when hooked up right. I have an Engl Savage and tried everything out today with my "lead" preset in the G-Major. The two gain knobs on the Engl were both at 3 o' clock, the volume at earplug-level and the G-Major had pitch shift, delay and reverb active. No noise, no hum, no squeal, nothing. Just a murdering tone and metal warfare. At last, I am home. Vorwärts!
#23
excellent news
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#24
Quote by Thaumiel
Ok, reporting back. I have now achieved perfection. The rig is dead ****en silent when I'm not playing and it sounds amazing. I am really stunned at how good this unit is when hooked up right. I have an Engl Savage and tried everything out today with my "lead" preset in the G-Major. The two gain knobs on the Engl were both at 3 o' clock, the volume at earplug-level and the G-Major had pitch shift, delay and reverb active. No noise, no hum, no squeal, nothing. Just a murdering tone and metal warfare. At last, I am home. Vorwärts!

Haha glad to hear it dude! I was fairly certain the parallel loop mix was the cause.
#25
Quote by Nolly
On the G-string vs twin decimator debate:

Basically, I believe it comes down to your setup. For example, I'm going to guess that TheEsupremacy boosts the front end of his 6505 with the Maxon or OCD, probably creating a more than normal level of hiss at the front end of the amp, while the hiss created in the preamp section is relatively little. If I'm right, then it seems logical that the same level of gating at both points (as per the G-string) will be pretty inefficient.
Perhaps for someone else's setup, they may find that the G-string works perfectly well; many people have specifically commented on how effective it is, despite it's single threshold control.

I guess the only way to find out is to try one. If it works satisfactorily, you save yourself a little cash, and end up with a neater rig.

Or buy the ProRack.



Ah confused me a bit :S. Are you saying that a G would be a good pedal if you are getting his/hum/etc from the pre-amp and the front of the amp, but otherwise the normal Decimator would be good enough if you are just getting high feedback from say an OD pedal going straight into your amps input?

(just asking as a likely ISP buyer)
"If you want beef, then bring the ruckus." - Marilyn Monroe
#26
Quote by USCENDONE BENE
Ah confused me a bit :S. Are you saying that a G would be a good pedal if you are getting his/hum/etc from the pre-amp and the front of the amp, but otherwise the normal Decimator would be good enough if you are just getting high feedback from say an OD pedal going straight into your amps input?

(just asking as a likely ISP buyer)


I was trying to say that if you have a source of extra noise in front of the amp, the G-string's single threshold control could be limiting - to get rid of the noise in the front, you'd be gating too hard after the preamp, or alternatively, you could set it so that the gate is perfect for after the preamp, but then not be sufficiently gated in front.
It's funny, because with the aid of a demonstration, this would be a very simple point to get across, but in words it is rather clumsy.