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#1
Why does the bass lines in Iron Maiden always stick out like a guitar line and the bass lines in Slayer and Metallica and other thrash metal bands are mostly inaudible?

(I'm a beginner musician, don't flame me!)
#2
because Harris is amazing and they just boost the bass compared to guitars volumes I guess
#3
its not really like that but what im thinking is the heavier distortion and lower tuings of the guitar of slayer etc overpower the bass line but sooner or later you will be able to pick them out like nothing just focus in takes some time though
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#4
Because Steve Harris' tone cuts through the mix like a knife, and the guitarists if Iron Maiden cut back on the lows a little unlike most of today's metal guitarists, so he also makes up most of the low end too.
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#5
Quote by fleajr_1412
Because Steve Harris' tone cuts through the mix like a knife, and the guitarists if Iron Maiden cut back on the lows a little unlike most of today's metal guitarists, so he also makes up most of the low end too.

thats exactly what i was getting at but you said it better kudos to you
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#6
Cause Steve Harris isn't a lazy bassist.
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#7
Quote by black-sabbath
Cause Steve Harris isn't a lazy bassist.


Neither is Robert Trujillo or Tom Araya. The main difference here is EQing and tone. A lot of Steve Harris stuff isn't that technical and a lot of Steve Harris lines stick to the roots (yes, I know he doesn't do it all the time, but he does still do it).
#8
Steve Harris owns Iron Maiden. It is his band. They adjust so he can be heard.
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#9
It all has to do with production. Harris is a bass god, but at the end of the day, if the production sucked, you'd never know it.
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#10
mosty metal nowardays has pretty much eliminated the need for a bass player, (blame nu metal) other to make inaudible rumbly sounds and grow ridiculous facial hair.
However, back in iron maidens time the guitars were more trebley, which makes gives the bass some sonic space to play around with.
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#11
Quote by wouldyakindly
mosty metal nowardays has pretty much eliminated the need for a bass player, (blame nu metal) other to make inaudible rumbly sounds and grow ridiculous facial hair.
However, back in iron maidens time the guitars were more trebley, which makes gives the bass some sonic space to play around with.


A fair few of the nu metal giants have very prominent bass- Korn, Mudvayne and Disturbed just off the top of my head. There has been inaudible bass in metal ever since it's inception- it's certainly not the fault of nu-metal, where the bass is actually pushed through the mix thanks to the help of hip hop influences in the genre.
#12
Quote by Deliriumbassist
A fair few of the nu metal giants have very prominent bass- Korn, Mudvayne and Disturbed just off the top of my head. There has been inaudible bass in metal ever since it's inception- it's certainly not the fault of nu-metal, where the bass is actually pushed through the mix thanks to the help of hip hop influences in the genre.

k, I obviously haven't listened to enough nu metal. sorry for the confusion.
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Funny old world eh.
#13
Quote by Deliriumbassist
A fair few of the nu metal giants have very prominent bass- Korn, Mudvayne and Disturbed just off the top of my head. There has been inaudible bass in metal ever since it's inception- it's certainly not the fault of nu-metal, where the bass is actually pushed through the mix thanks to the help of hip hop influences in the genre.

I agree with you on the prominent bass thing, but imo in a whole bunch of nu metal like Korn the bass just sounds like a lot of clicks and a low rumble. Korn's bassist shouldn't scoop his mids so much.
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#14
The title of the thread of misleading, I thought it was going the be about bass made out of metal. "All shall bow to the industructable titanium bass!"

To stay on topic though, i'd have to agree with the production and EQ comments. It all comes down if the bassists owns the low end or not.
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#15
Steve Harris also uses flatwound strings, but again this is where EQ becomes an important factor
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#17
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P basses. That's why

....Don't think so


Harris uses flatwounds and boosts his treble. The guitarists also have high treble so the low frequencies of the bass shine through better. Iron Maiden does a lot of high guitar parts where heavier bands will go for lower riffs and their bass is way up there. A lot of Metal bassist will get put low in the production, not to mention that they scoop their mids which kills their sound. If you're a bassist playing Metal you should either keep your mids flat or boost them unless you want to be inaudible.
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#18
A major part is due to the eq of the band.

Another part of it is the composition of the song. If the song was made with guitars screaming solos and trying to destroy your face at every second and the drums trying to beat a hole in your wall, you will not hear the bass. If the song was made with a more laid back (this can still be metal) feel, you will generally hear the bass.

Another part is inexperience in listening to the bass. People's minds generally do not focus on the bass of a song. It takes the most effort to listen to and is generally softer than the guitars. Most people are not ready to try and listen to the bass. For example I generally can hear the bass in any song there is a bass (Metallica included!) The level of being able to hear it is always variable according to the previous points.
#19
Quote by TormentedRx
A major part is due to the eq of the band.

Another part of it is the composition of the song. If the song was made with guitars screaming solos and trying to destroy your face at every second and the drums trying to beat a hole in your wall, you will not hear the bass. If the song was made with a more laid back (this can still be metal) feel, you will generally hear the bass.

Another part is inexperience in listening to the bass. People's minds generally do not focus on the bass of a song. It takes the most effort to listen to and is generally softer than the guitars. Most people are not ready to try and listen to the bass. For example I generally can hear the bass in any song there is a bass (Metallica included!) The level of being able to hear it is always variable according to the previous points.
I've been a bassist for about a year and it took me awhile before I could hear bass in any song. To learn basslines by ear, I just don't pay attention to the vocals and lead guitar and focus on the rhythm section;the drums, bass, and rhythm guitar. I hear the rhythm guitar and then listen to the bass that's under that and then listen to the drums to help figure out rhythms.
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#20
Quote by TormentedRx
For example I generally can hear the bass in any song there is a bass (Metallica included!)


Not on AJFA, 'cause it ain't there.

Now I know you guys think that TalkBass is full of crap, but a guy there made an excellent thread on the challenges and techniques of fingerstyle bass in metal.

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=378173
#21
Quote by BladeSlinger
....Don't think so


Harris uses flatwounds and boosts his treble. The guitarists also have high treble so the low frequencies of the bass shine through better. Iron Maiden does a lot of high guitar parts where heavier bands will go for lower riffs and their bass is way up there. A lot of Metal bassist will get put low in the production, not to mention that they scoop their mids which kills their sound. If you're a bassist playing Metal you should either keep your mids flat or boost them unless you want to be inaudible.



Course, the natural mid-hump in a P bass has nothing to do with any of that
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#22
It depends on the production, but some metal bases are also quite distorted and get lost even easier with guitars.
#23
Quote by Arbitror
Not on AJFA, 'cause it ain't there.

Now I know you guys think that TalkBass is full of crap, but a guy there made an excellent thread on the challenges and techniques of fingerstyle bass in metal.

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=378173


When did we say that? A lot of regulars on here are regulars over on TB (myself included), so why would we hate it?
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#24
Quote by fleajr_1412
When did we say that? A lot of regulars on here are regulars over on TB (myself included), so why would we hate it?

this. TB aint bad, I just like UG-BF better, because these guys agree with me much more.
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#25
I prefer UG too, but there's more pros on TB, so it's a better place to ask really confusing questions. A lot of famous people are on TB too, you just have to find them.
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#26
though it is fun to joke around about them. that thread on the girl with the 'problem' was rather sad.
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#28
I find that it's easier to hear bass in a lot of death metal bands, even though they do tune lower and the guitarists usually stick to the lower chords.
#29
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though it is fun to joke around about them. that thread on the girl with the 'problem' was rather sad.


Yeah. Did she sort it out in the end? (Are you thinking of the one when the strap got in the way? Or are you thinking of something else?)
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#30
Quote by eschaton
Course, the natural mid-hump in a P bass has nothing to do with any of that

If your mids are scooped that won't do much good though.


I can hear the bass in parts of Blackened by Metallica. To Live Is To Die has pretty audible bass in terms of AJFA.
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#31
Quote by BladeSlinger
If your mids are scooped that won't do much good though.


I can hear the bass in parts of Blackened by Metallica. To Live Is To Die has pretty audible bass in terms of AJFA.

if you have a good ear for bass (and i mean really good) you can hear the bass. i can hear the bass in One and To Live is to Die is parts here and there
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#32
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Is this thread about talk bass or metal bass?

sorry.

I really need to stop spamming. it just happens.

I do stop though. eventually...
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I wouldn't call what we have here on the Bass Forum a mentality. It's more like the sharing part of an AA meeting.

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#33
My advice in hearing the bass in heavy metal: Get a Gallien Krueger, turn it up, and DON'T PLAY WHAT THE THE GUITARS ARE PLAYING.
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#34
Not all bassists are inaudible.
Look at bands like He Is Legend, Between the Buried and Me, and Protest the Hero.
All phenomenal bassists, especially the latter of the three.

Between the Buried and Me has a real heavy bass sound.
They all share in their sound, which is great.
Great prog. metal.
#35
Quote by Helloween4Ever
if you have a good ear for bass (and i mean really good) you can hear the bass. i can hear the bass in One and To Live is to Die is parts here and there

I can just barely hear it in One and a few other songs....The more I listen to the album the more I can pick it out. I would love to learn the whole album on bass one day. Blackened sounds so great on bass.
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Why would you spend tens of thousands of dollars to learn about a language you already speak? It was over before it even started dude

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brot pls
#36
Different styles and different roles... Maiden have lighter guitars than Metallica - plus most of the time you can hear the bass anyway...
Signed.
#37
Cody is right, don't play what the guitars are playing if you want to be heard. Sometimes it is good to play what they are playing, but in general the bass should be playing something between the drums and the guitars, this generally means around the drum beat, but riffs following (somewhat) what the guitars playing.
#38
Quote by BladeSlinger
I can just barely hear it in One and a few other songs....The more I listen to the album the more I can pick it out. I would love to learn the whole album on bass one day. Blackened sounds so great on bass.


Theres a boosted bass version of blackened on youtube. It sounds so powerful. I could pick it out in the original after listening to it too.

I play metal bass and face a lot of the problems hilighted. Just don't completly scoop the mids, leave something there, and not too much treble or bass either.

What the guy says on talk bass works too, with the harsher fingerpicking technique. Works a treat. I can hear myself under 2 guitars and have the sonic ability to fill the space with only one guitar like there is in my band.
#40
second bonesaw's reply. also, you don't have "bassist ear" if you play bass enough, you can't help but to hear it.
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