#1
Alright well, let me start off by saying I don't bash these amps for no reason. I bash these amps because they're cheaply built knock-offs of other amps. The reason I don't like them is not just because I think they lack warmth and clarity in there tone, but because they're horribly made. Ever since I've been on this forum I've seen these amps being recommended to alot of musicians, and seeing many people praise these amp heads.

A buddy of mine, well, more of an aquantance (spelling?) of mine, baught one of these amps a few months ago. He was planning on buying something much nicer, but figured he would give the Bugera a try. After only 8 days of owning and playing the amp, the amp had completely died. It wasn't a problem with the fuse, or a bad pot, but the inside of the amp had actually begun to fry.

Believe me? No, you probably don't, so here are pictures of other people who have had problems with these amps.

-You notice anything wrong there?


-Hard to see, but I'm sure it will be a bit more noticable here:


-Do you want this in your amp?


-How about this?


Here, take a closer look:



From spending alot of my time on other forums besides here at UG, I've come across many problems with these amps. I've even taken the privilage of trying these amps myself, to see what all the fus what about. Three (3) of the Bugeras I seen in shops wouldn't even turn on, which is not a good thing. The few that had worked for me had sounded very thin, and were lacking alot of clarity. It's as if these amps were being built using leftover parts which had been laying around.

I'm not trying to judge these amps by tone, but by the build quality as well. I'm sure there are quite a few people here who own a Bugera amp, and may possibly like it. This thread isn't made to stop people from purchasing these amps, but to show why I consider these amps to be junk. After reading the bad reviews, seeing pictures and trying them for myself, it's safe to say that I will never be an owner of a Bugera product. If you're in the market for a new amp, then it'd probably be best to put a little more cash up and getting the real thing. I've never seen or heard any other company have as many problems as this company in such little time.

That, UG, is why I'm seen suggesting other users to try other amps before purchasing a Bugera. This thread was not made to turn into a flame war, or bashing any users on here, but to show how I, and many others, look at this amp company.


-Mike.
#2
I would agree about the build quality. Though many other amps aren't built much better, and you have to take into account differences between models.

The two that I played worked fine and sounded good for what they are. IIRC, they come with a 2 year warranty or something comparable, so keep that in mind.

I would be interested to know the percentage of breakdowns/total amps sold, though.
#3
Meh, mine still works fine (even though my best friend owns it now). Just think how many people bought one of these and how many people actually had a problem like this. Every amp line has some issues. These are still new, they've only been out since like January. That's what a warranty is for anyway. I still recommend them, especially for the price/tone.
#4
I've heard that most of the break downs happen very early, which to me means that if you're is gonna break, its gonna happen before you warranty runs out.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#5
That's my point, I've never seen an amp company have more problems like this in such a short period of time. I'm not sure if it's just coincidence, but most of the problems with Bugera have occured in the USA, so I'm not sure if it's just something being shipped to our dealers, but I don't see how that'd be possible.

EDIT-
To the post above, why would you want to buy an amp head if you know theres a good chance it may have to be replaced? I like the fact that it comes with a warranty, but I wouldn't purchase an item just so I can ship it back to get replaced.
Last edited by caraluzzo at Sep 22, 2008,
#6
Some people might not be bothered by that, but I see where you're coming from. I'm just playing devil's advocate here, I'm always one to say spend a bit more and be that much happier in the long run.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#8
I really don't see this as being a big issue. There hasn't been any fires, recalls, or major problems. Just a few bad apples in the bunch. I think a lot has to do with cheap manufacturing/unskilled labor and rough shipping. Nobody has claimed these amps are built like tanks. They arn't Bogners. Ulitmately, you will get what you pay for. They are what they are, a great sounding budget amp for the masses. They really do fill a niche that needed to be filled. I'm hoping by this time next year we have even more competition from amp manufacturers all over the globe.
#9
I made this comment earlier about how NEW of anything will have issues at first. Amps, cars, toasters, PCs, etc. Time will tell. Let's not get into a rant fest tho and instigate flaming. That happened with a I Hate Valvekings thread not too long ago and it didn't work out. It got closed.

*there are pictures like this of all kinds of amps*

Edit #1. I'm not saying I'm defending or promoting this amp. There have been reliability issues that are well documented here on UG. I've never used the amp. I've not bothered to check other forums like HC. I have heard that there are more problems with the 333x series then then the 62xx series whatever let alone the rest of them so be specific. And yes, that looks like pepsi.

Edit #2. If you only have so much money to spend and you want a certain tone - sometimes you have to sacrafice if you want a NEW amp. This is why some of us recommend craigslist all the time@!

Edit #3. I realize I'm talking out of both sides of my mouth but my point remains.

Edit #4. You also have to realize that amps back in the day (70's and 60's) didn't have the mass audiance they do today nor were they mass produced. Do you feed a few or do feed the market? Net Present Value of money and disposable income also come into play. I mean FFS look at my sig.
Last edited by 311ZOSOVHJH at Sep 23, 2008,
#10
Could you possibly post a shot of the entire chassis? That shows all the wiring and lead dress?

Sorry, I read on here that these amps were "handwired" and am just curious to see the quality of lead dress.
#11
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
I made this comment earlier about how NEW of anything will have issues at first. Amps, cars, toasters, PCs, etc. Time will tell. Let's not get into a rant fest tho and instigate flaming. That happened with a I Hate Valvekings thread not too long ago and it didn't work out. It got closed.

*there are pictures like this of all kinds of amps*


Truth.
#12
Quote by al112987
Could you possibly post a shot of the entire chassis? That shows all the wiring and lead dress?

Sorry, I read on here that these amps were "handwired" and am just curious to see the quality of lead dress.



I'll see if I can get more.
And I'm sure there are pics like this from other amp manufractuers, but not in such little time. Most amp companys don't allow amps to the public unless they know they've gotten all the problems. Obviously, Bugera seams to do things differently.

I agree that for a while now we've needed a line of descent amps at a good price, but from all the problems occuring so quickly, I find it hard to call these amps descent. I feel that if you're spending that kind of money an amp, you may as well just put up some more cash and get the real thing. From what I've read, these amps are suppose to be cheap clones, but they sound nothing like the real deal.

There haven't been any complaints of the amps catching on fire or anything, as far as I know, but there have been complaints of smelling something burning in some amps. I'm not sure exactly what it is they're smelling that could be burning, because I have yet to see pictures of the inside of one that supposably has this problem.

I'm not trying to turn this into a flame war, I've said this in my first post of the thread, I just figured I'd give some insight as to why I dislike this amp company, rather then people wondering all the time. I for one, would not want to buy an amp that has a good chance of being damaged after a short period of time, wether it has a warranty or not. If I ever bothered to buy one of these amps, I'd probably buy two, this way I still have one to play while the others getting fixed.


Once again, this thread wasn't made to turn into a flame war. If you disagree with me, then okay, I could care less what you spend your money on, but I know there are others out there who feel the same way and hear just as many bad things about these amps as I do. Not to mention, in my opinion, they sound like garbage, and I believe there are many better amps out there around the same price.
#13
you know, theres a reason that when you are in a casino lights go off when someone wins big, but never when someone loses big. which happens more often though? now which are you more likely to notice?

same thing here, the people who have bad things happen are the ones to speak up and they have something clear to show (such as pics). but for the (at most) three amps you have pictures of, how many of other amps are built solidly with no problems? im not saying that the build quality is great, ive never tried one. but im just saying that a few bad apples doesnt mean you have to raze the orchard.

also, i like to keep in mind that the bugeras are fairly new amps. its not like Vox AC30s of the world that have been out for a long time and have been pretty much perfected. maybe in a few years all these bugs will be worked out. maybe the quality control issues will become more prevalent and the amps will go out of production. who knows?
#14
Quote by jof1029
you know, theres a reason that when you are in a casino lights go off when someone wins big, but never when someone loses big. which happens more often though? now which are you more likely to notice?

same thing here, the people who have bad things happen are the ones to speak up and they have something clear to show (such as pics). but for the (at most) three amps you have pictures of, how many of other amps are built solidly with no problems? im not saying that the build quality is great, ive never tried one. but im just saying that a few bad apples doesnt mean you have to raze the orchard.

also, i like to keep in mind that the bugeras are fairly new amps. its not like Vox AC30s of the world that have been out for a long time and have been pretty much perfected. maybe in a few years all these bugs will be worked out. maybe the quality control issues will become more prevalent and the amps will go out of production. who knows?


Yes. You definitely hit the nail on the head.

The few situations where people have had bad experiences with the amps are gonna stick out more than the thousands of people who have had good experiences because the people with bad experiences are gonna go on every forum and website they can and bitch, complain, and raise hell about the amps; where as the people with good experiences are gonna sit back, keep their mouths shut, and enjoy their wonderful new amps.

TS: Those last few pictures look like somebody just poured a can of Pepsi on their amp and claimed that it was a factory error.
#15
i remember these pics from months ago when they first debuted.

i haven't heard of anything gone wrong since.


yes, of course they are sold so cheaply because they use cheaper parts... that's why they're sold cheaper. they sound good, and as long as they hold up and/or backed by a decent warranty, i think it's a risk worth taking for some.
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#16
I'm not disagreeing with any of you. These are just pics I could find at the moment, but there are a lot of reviews with the same problems with other people.

This company may as well join up with Behringer.
#17
firstly lemme say that i've never played one and can't comment on their quality or sound. But sometimes when you buy something, it's possible its a faulty one. Not only amps, but anything.

Personally i've never heard of anyone having a problem similar to this. But honestly I havn't really been paying attention. but they are on the cheaper side, and usually with guitars, or amps and what not you do get what you pay for.

but can't comment on the lack of warmth and tone. as i havn't played one. But i am sorry for the bad luck, I would be pissed and on the phone with the company imediately
-------------------------------
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#18
^They certainly do lack warmth. I would never buy one for what I do; they just wouldn't cut it. They're br00tz amps.
#19
I'm pasting in my edits 2, 3 and 4 for emphasis. It is a tough bump but may be worthy to newcomers looking for Reviews and Brands.

Edit #2. If you only have so much money to spend and you want a certain tone - sometimes you have to sacrafice if you want a NEW amp. This is why some of us recommend craigslist all the time@!

Edit #3. I realize I'm talking out of both sides of my mouth but my point remains.

Edit #4. You also have to realize that amps back in the day (70's and 60's) didn't have the mass audiance they do today nor were they mass produced. Do you feed a few or do feed the market? Net Present Value of money and disposable income also come into play. I admit I do not have the best gear.
#20
^ For that matter, everyone forgets the old unreliable products... they're 20 years in the landfill already.
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#21
Quote by caraluzzo
This company may as well join up with Behringer.


this company is Behringer.
http://www.guitarplayer.com/article/bugera-333-212/jul-08/86639

Uli Behringer on the Bugera Series:

“Since I was 15 years old, I’ve been collecting antique tube radios, and because of this passion for valves, it has always been my dream to build high-end, boutique-style tube amps,” explains Behringer founder and chairman Uli Behringer. “When you study valve amps, you’ll find the technology is relatively simple, and nothing groundbreaking has been invented in recent years. All circuits are standard, and you’re basically left with playing around with tube stages and component values. But there are three major aspects that make the sound of an amp: the valves, the output transformer, and the PCB layout and component quality. When we started the Bugera project two years ago, we brought in some incredible engineers who are also passionate guitarists. They examined all Matchless, Rivera, Soldano, Mesa/Boogie, Bogner, Marshall, and Peavey amps, and they asked musicians what they liked about each specific amp. We also introduced a rigorous valve-selection process, and only five percent make it to our highest grade, which is used as each amp’s first and most critical gain stage. For the output transformer, we spent more than a year selecting the highest-grade materials, as well as defining a meticulous method for winding the copper wire, and how the final assembly must be executed. Open the amps, and you will understand what I mean. They are beautiful inside, and you can see the love for detail that went into their design.”
"The fool doth think he is wise, but the wiseman knows himself to be a fool." - W.S.
amp clips
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#23
Quote by caraluzzo
^That explains ALOT!

What exactly is your agenda against Bugera?
If I'm reading right that isn't even your amp?
I'm gonna stop short of calling those pics bs, but I
have issues with them. That's a LOT of fluid. Too much
IMHO.
#24
Hi,

Those pics were originally posted over at HC by the guitar player in Kanye West's touring band. He kind of took the blame for the failure. Apparently he received the amp late last winter and removed it from the box and fired it up right away. Of course that is a NO-NO!

I am sure you all know that when you take a cold item (the Bugera) and put it in a warm environment condensation will form. That is why one needs to allow time for the evaporation of that moisture before you start applying high-voltages to it!!

Anyways, all I will say is that this same person still plays Bugera amps and has very good things to say about them. He has also (to my most recent knowledge) not experienced any other failures with the 2 other Bugera amps he owns. I even remember him stating that his friend gave up a Mesa for a Bugera.

Chow,
BP
#25
so one cap went

that happens with all amp manufacturers

tbh one 'horror story' isnt even reason enough
Get off this damn forum and play your damn guitar.
#26
Quote by buddhapaugh
Hi,

Those pics were originally posted over at HC by the guitar player in Kanye West's touring band. He kind of took the blame for the failure. Apparently he received the amp late last winter and removed it from the box and fired it up right away. Of course that is a NO-NO!

I am sure you all know that when you take a cold item (the Bugera) and put it in a warm environment condensation will form. That is why one needs to allow time for the evaporation of that moisture before you start applying high-voltages to it!!

Anyways, all I will say is that this same person still plays Bugera amps and has very good things to say about them. He has also (to my most recent knowledge) not experienced any other failures with the 2 other Bugera amps he owns. I even remember him stating that his friend gave up a Mesa for a Bugera.

Chow,
BP


Exfuckingactly
#27
Basically, your biggest point here is that you don't like the tone at all. Well, you know what? A lot of people do love the tone. It's called an opinion. And "saving a bit more and buying the real one" (outside US) is the same thing as "buying two so I can play one while the other is being fixed), because the Peavey equivalents (they aren't exact copies, but the 6505/XXX are quite close) cost almost twice what a Bugera costs.
Quote by Lunchbox362
This thread if fail in almost every way imaniganable.
#28
^ yeah and the 6505/XXX's are twice the amp.
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#29
I've played 2 or 3 Bugeras and they haven't broken on me.

Yet, I've played 2 Laneys and they have both broken on me.

Amp companies aren't perfect, the Bugeras are a decent cheap way for people to get a metal amp. Okay so the QC isn't great now, but now they are on I would guess the second run the QC is going to be much better.
#30
My old Bugera 6262 half stack has been through hell and back. Although I sold it to my best friend he literally abuses the thing and it's still running like a champ. He retubed it with all JJ's, biased it, and put V30's in the Bugera cab and it sounds just flat out great. Very desireable tone(s). He spent a LOT of money on that amp and the final tones were worth every penny. I honestly miss it. If I knew a tube and speaker change would really have that profound an effect on it, I probably would have kept it.
#31
I'm glad I got a 6505 instead of a 626x. I paid more but I've got something that's proven durable and that's very important to me as I have no cash for a decent backup at the moment.
Rig

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#32
when it all boiils down to it, you get what you pay for. there are some rare occurances that defy the rule, like when a non guitar freak is selling a 50's fender champ in working condition for 20$ at a garage sale, but most of the time, it's dead on.

plus, what else do you expect from Behringer? Quality?
Quote by patriotplayer90
Lolz that guy is a noob.

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#33
Quote by x_themetalfan_x
I'm glad I got a 6505 instead of a 626x. I paid more but I've got something that's proven durable and that's very important to me as I have no cash for a decent backup at the moment.

Ultimately, that's what I did too.
#34
Oh stop whining. Bugera is a pretty new company and ANY company is going to have problems with a brand new product line.

Car companies, computer companies, prescription manufacturers, etc. Basically anything is going to have problems. Why do you think you see recalls of things on tv or on the radio? How do you explain Microsoft, Apple and other software manufacturers having lots of bugs on launch? It's unavoidable. Companies release their product as best as they can to reach their quota and leave it up to the consumer to find errors with it, send it in with the warranty, and have them fix it so that they'll be able to release newer versions of the product, free of these faults.

Yes, the Bugeras might not use the best parts ever, but look at the other amps, the parts being used are easily on par with others in their price range. However, Bugeras have FAR better tubes installed in them, TAD Power Tubes and Shuguang Preamp Tubes. You don't get that kind of quality tubes until you start paying $2000 for amps, otherwise you're just going to get some cheap rebranded Sovteks.

The amps they're copies of don't use great parts either by any means. Peavey uses pretty poor electronics, but they have been making their amps for years, so their amps are obviously going to be more reliable.

As far as your bashing the tone. For the price, they sound pretty damn good to me. Show me any other amp at that price new that sounds that good and can be that versatile.
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#35
/hugs my Mesa after reading this thread

I don't trust hype; I had heard of the shoddy build quality of these amps, but wow; those pics look NASTY.
#36
Quote by RG_FANMAN
/hugs my Mesa after reading this thread

I don't trust hype; I had heard of the shoddy build quality of these amps, but wow; those pics look NASTY.


you do realise these pics are months old and are probably the only ones on the internet. They're the only ones I've ever seen, that's for sure.

and as somebody else has already posted, it's partly down to user error as well.

you say you don't trust the hype? don't trust the hype about their unreliability. you'd think there'd be more than this one set of pictures on the entire internet if it was really as bad as people make it out to be.

EDIT: I want to see what the TS has to say about this post

Quote by buddhapaugh
Hi,

Those pics were originally posted over at HC by the guitar player in Kanye West's touring band. He kind of took the blame for the failure. Apparently he received the amp late last winter and removed it from the box and fired it up right away. Of course that is a NO-NO!

I am sure you all know that when you take a cold item (the Bugera) and put it in a warm environment condensation will form. That is why one needs to allow time for the evaporation of that moisture before you start applying high-voltages to it!!

Anyways, all I will say is that this same person still plays Bugera amps and has very good things to say about them. He has also (to my most recent knowledge) not experienced any other failures with the 2 other Bugera amps he owns. I even remember him stating that his friend gave up a Mesa for a Bugera.

Chow,
BP


I'm sure he has some sort of reason why this user is wrong
Rhythm in Jump. Dancing Close to You.

Quote by element4433
Yeah. people, like Lemoninfluence, are hypocrites and should have all their opinions invalidated from here on out.
Last edited by Lemoninfluence at Sep 25, 2008,
#37
Quote by RG_FANMAN
/hugs my Mesa after reading this thread

I don't trust hype; I had heard of the shoddy build quality of these amps, but wow; those pics look NASTY.

The biggest lemon of an amp I ever owned was a Mesa Recto back in the day. It was a nightmare. It was in the shop more than I actually had it in my possession, so don't hug it too hard. I think this post just goes to show anybody can have a bad experience with ANY amp company.
#38
/\

I've got a DC head; completely different from the recto. It's 15 years old (though i've only owned it for about half a year), hasn't had a problem that I can tell, everything's clean on the inside, works wonderful. Tell me that isn't good construction. I wouldn't doubt you've had a lemon, but in all honesty I don't really like Rectos, so I can't comment on their reliability.

/\/\

Yea, those are the only pictures i've seen, but I've heard from other people that the Bugera's arent the most reliable things in the world. And I only really read the OP, so I have no idea why I posted "thread" in my response. And I haven't really cared to look up any more pictures or horror stories since, in all honestly, I find no real need since I have an amp I really like and find the few Bugera clips on the net to be sub-par (for all I know the amp sounds great in person, but w/e), so I haven't honestly looked into that much.