I just bought a Esp ninja (2006) with mirror pickguard and I love it, but it has spertzel tuners which can't fit anything larger than a 56 gauge string in the low E. The problem with that is I want to tune to two whole steps down from standard ( C F Bb Eb G c) and the strings just don't have enough resistance and I dont want to drill out the headstock and put in new tuners.

I need a second opinion on an idea I've been debating recently. Now I'm considering selling my Jackson RR24 limited edition 1of 75 with reversed shark fins (with gold schaler floyd rose and EMG pa2, and black jackson gotoh tuners) (think alexi laiho's wildchild jackson guitar from Children of Bodom, minus the sticker) for a new Esp ninja (2008). The new ninja has grover tuners which would and could handle string gauges larger than 56 gauge. I would put the guitar in two whole steps down from standard with a set of 13's that I could make from D'Addario 7 string set (13-59) and set up the other ninja with 11's or 12's in a half step down from standard.

Here are the pros and cons about it:

Pros (ninja)
* I can put the ninja in what ever tuning I want ( I want to occassional go a half step down to B, to mess around in that tuning and to play certain arch enemy songs)
* They no longer make the new ninjas
* Two passive pickups- Duncans- Sound more organic in my amp and seem to have more life than the EMG 81
* Better Sustain
* More Tonality
* Maple top and neck offer a similar sound to the other ninja but different as well in the sense that it will be brighter as well

Cons (Ninja):
* Ninja only has 22 frets

Concerns (Ninja):
My friend told me that if you use too light a string gauge when a guitar has been set up for low tunings that the too little tension on the strings and from the truss rod can cause it to shred the nut over time. He said to basically keep it in one tuning to avoid issues with the nut by either tuning down lower than the guitar has been set up for (in this case going a half step down).


Pro (RR24)
* It has a great metal and rock crunch sound in the amp
* The fretboard gets flatter as you go up making it easier to play on the higher notes
* It also looks and feels rather perfect. I mean this is like a step down from a custom shop guitar qualitiy wise and all my work was done by a luthier and is in perfect condition.
* It's limited edition version of my guitar, no longer made (1 of 75 produced)
* Whammy bar

Con (RR24):
* A Floyd rose can be a pain (changing strings, to bend and knocking certain strings out of tune which knocks most if not all of them out of tune)
* Difficult toexperiment outside a certain tuning
* One pickup (EMG 81) limited tonality
* Clean doesn't feel that clean and can feel a little distorted
* Limited sustain
* Can feel too overdriven in the amp

What do you guys think? I would appreciate any feedback on anything expressed. What would you guys do?
only read the first couple of lines.

change the tuners on your ninja. It's cheaper than getting a new guitar and you get to keep your limited edition RR24.

keep the RR24 in standard or Eb and have your ninja for lower tunings. No trem means you can change tunings quickly and easily without having to mess about too much.
Rhythm in Jump. Dancing Close to You.

Quote by element4433
Yeah. people, like Lemoninfluence, are hypocrites and should have all their opinions invalidated from here on out.
Last edited by Lemoninfluence at Sep 26, 2008,
I'd go with the Ninja because of the tonal versatility. And get it setup for the tuning your gonna use most of the time, then try and stick in that area.

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yeah just change the tuners in your Ninja and keep the rr24, no point in having 2 guitars the same.
Quote by SlayedInTheFace
I would wank over all of you if I was a gay paedophile who liked simultanous gay wanking
I would keep the RR24, you might regret selling such a rare guitar!

I would either drill for new machineheads, much easier and cheaper to do.
+1 on changing the tuners. I'd sell the RR myself, but then again, I'm a big ESP/LTD fan.
Quote by lizarday
oh yeah? well larry king the slayer guitarist owns bc rich guitars. (i think)
Changing tuners on your ESP sounds like the most economical answer.
How about you just file the low E- string's slot on the nut down a bit to accomodate the bigger string? That sounds like the problem to me, not the tuners, because I've put in .60's on my Epi and it worked just fine, again sounds like the nut is the problem, not the tuners.
Last edited by Eric 666 at Sep 26, 2008,
Why don't you sell your old ninja? If you can't do that, keep the RR. Use your old ninja for standard, and the RR for drop tuning. Selling a limited edition RR (especially with a make as low as 75) now would be a terrible idea. Wait 10 more years, and you can reap massive profits with it, or keep it just for fondness's sake.
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^Bit vague question, there's quite a lot of Gotoh models. Got a link to the Gotoh tuners?