#1
I'm wondering how I'd go about putting together chords in terms of the circle of fifths.

1.Do I need to start at, lets say C, and have to go to either G or F or could i got from a C chord to a B?


I'm using this for reference:
http://files.meetup.com/227762/Circle%20of%20Fifths%20wheel.gif

2.Whats the triad(ex. F has F-A-C) are those the only notes I can go to after that triad, and if so when I get to A from F can I change to either A triad?


3.And how do ppl come up with a riff using something like this?:

D(b)|--7-9-10- (notes from AFI -death of seasons)
E(b)|--0-0--0-
Last edited by ldiablo233 at Oct 15, 2008,
#2
yea im not sure about that
the circle of fifths is an awesome thing htat has alot of features with it

the one i found the most important (personally) are keys:
Keys are made up of 6 chords, you find a chord and move left one, then right one (from original one you chose). Both the major key and minor keys are part of that chord
try it out

Example: Key of G will have C, G, D & Am, Em Bm
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#3
and um
3rd question
those are from scales
check out www.modemaster.com

youll see (make sure you correctly adjust youre tuning)
and note: scale of G major = scale of Em, in terms of notes
Taylor 314CE
Modulus G2T and G3CT
3 Warmoth Guitars
2 Fender MIA Strats--SRV & JM
Alvarez w/ Modulus Neck and EMG DG-20s
Marshall JCM 2000 DSL 50 w/ 1960a cab
Breedlove AC250/SM12
Gold Tone Weissenborn
Adrenalinn III & FCB1010
ALOT of pedals
#4
Ok take A single second ,being a simple song, for example. He starts with a Bm in the intro and then goes down a whole step staying at Bm then changes to Abm(hes playing powerchords so I'm geussing you just don't count the other notes not played..), would that be consider still an A cause Abm or Ab is not within the three keys. I also see F is the same as Ab, but the Ab has a 4 next to it so I'm geussing its a Ab from the forth fret on?


For the song Days of the pheonix I have found in the intro riff and the chords behind it the notes B,D,A,F#,C#,E. I noticed on that Mode master tool when he hit the 11 there was not number on the neck. I did the song in G, even though the fourth fret on the G string is a B there where spots where there was no number on the Mode master for the 3 fret on the b string in B major mode. I got through the intro but onto the verse there was a note that was C# but there is no note in CGD keys that are C#. I also figured its fine to start it in G major because B is a triad...HELP!!!!
Last edited by ldiablo233 at Oct 15, 2008,
#5
bro u needa learn some theory
goto justinguitar.com, and start with the basics

anyway, here
the triads are the three notes of the a scale that comprise the chord you play
scale of g: G-A-B-C-D-E-F#
the triad is the 1-3-5 notes: G-B-D

and as for your other question, each chord can be part of 6 different keys:
example: the chord C will be part of key of F, key of C, key G
now if you take the minors too, since they count, key of C will also be in key of Dm, key of Am, and key of Em
not all songs need to be played in a key
or can be played in different keys in different parts

powerchords just play the three notes of the triad of the chord itself
as u know there are 6 strings, and some notes double to play the full chord, thats all

and
it does NOT matter where you play each chord on the guitar
a chord is the chord, just the octive would change
um
yea
thats all i got
Taylor 314CE
Modulus G2T and G3CT
3 Warmoth Guitars
2 Fender MIA Strats--SRV & JM
Alvarez w/ Modulus Neck and EMG DG-20s
Marshall JCM 2000 DSL 50 w/ 1960a cab
Breedlove AC250/SM12
Gold Tone Weissenborn
Adrenalinn III & FCB1010
ALOT of pedals
#6
I get the whole first part about the 1-3-5, what I don't get is you said for instance we start in key of F. I play the C chord because its a major triad of F, but I was told you can only go one over from the Key,which was F, so how am I in the "key of C" when I started in the key of F?

And Idk what it is I've been to everysite but they all seem to be missing something that gets you to understand the circle. I know Chords but I don't seem to get how to utilize them in the Circle and maintaining that structure rather then just play any chords or notes I feel like playing. I do also understand how you get a F on the first fret of the Open E and so forth.
Last edited by ldiablo233 at Oct 16, 2008,
#7
haha
bro
i love you so ill try to keep helping u

if you play two chords, you are you are in alot of different keys
but if you play F, C, and Bb (/A#), you can only be in the key of? F
thats right (Dm too tecnically, but forget that)

when it comes to key, just ignore the whole triad thing you keep doing
and look at the 6 chords in a key
play around with them
switch between any two
add a third, you will see what i mean about keys
then just rotate it
so instead of playing the 6 chords in the key of F: Bb, Gm, F, Dm, C, Am
play the 6 chords in the key of C: F, Dm, C, Am, G, Em

look at this one:
http://library.thinkquest.org/05aug/01262/Circle_of_fifths.gif
its a bit easier to interpret

i feel like, you are trying to hard to tackle the whole thing at once
understand and really learn a certain part of theory
then progress on

there is ALOT to the circle, the more and more you will realize with theory
as of right now
just learn what chords make up a key
and learn how keys sound (in general)

you will start to notice a pattern as you play through keys
Taylor 314CE
Modulus G2T and G3CT
3 Warmoth Guitars
2 Fender MIA Strats--SRV & JM
Alvarez w/ Modulus Neck and EMG DG-20s
Marshall JCM 2000 DSL 50 w/ 1960a cab
Breedlove AC250/SM12
Gold Tone Weissenborn
Adrenalinn III & FCB1010
ALOT of pedals
#8
I've been trying to figure things out but ofcourse still confused. Heres a riff off mine:

e|----------------------------------------------------
b|----------------------------------------------------
g|----------------0----------------------0-----------
D|--------0---------------------0----------0-----0-
A|-----5------------0-----5-5----5-5--------0-----
E|--3--------3---------3----------------------------

and the second parts just with 022 instead of 350

The first note is a G, when I use the C major selected on the interactive fretboard. But if I change it to certain keys such as A the 3rd fret E string has no note there, does that mean that I can play this riff in any key that has those notes on the fretboard?
#9
edit: your question

Quote by ldiablo233
I've been trying to figure things out but ofcourse still confused. Heres a riff off mine:

e|----------------------------------------------------
b|----------------------------------------------------
g|----------------0----------------------0-----------
D|--------0---------------------0----------0-----0-
A|-----5------------0-----5-5----5-5--------0-----
E|--3--------3---------3----------------------------

and the second parts just with 022 instead of 350

The first note is a G, when I use the C major selected on the interactive fretboard. But if I change it to certain keys such as A the 3rd fret E string has no note there, does that mean that I can play this riff in any key that has those notes on the fretboard?


I think if you play those in any key that has those notes, it'll still sound different if you surround it in OTHER music arranged for that key. In other words it'll change the mood of your riff within that key because it'll be in a different mode. I'm not much of a music theory guy but this is my take on it. other ppl plz help me explain it better or tell me if I'm straight up wrong

rest of my old post---------------


I started making mnemonics to learn the major triads and the circle of fifths. helps me alot

here's how my brain works, I like to look for patterns and stuff.

warning, I tend memorize some things very strangely

F      fidel
C      castro        //    top of circle of fifths (0 sharps)
G      gets          //    G major, first sharp starting at the same pattern (F)
D      drunk         //    two sharps (F C)
A      at            //    three sharps   (F C G)  
E      every         //    four sharps (F C G D)
B      bar           //    five sharps (F C G D A)
                     //  (loop back to same pattern but shuffle F to back and start at G)
Gb/F#    gets        //    six sharps, six flats - reverse order this way (B E A D G C)
Db       drunk       //    five flats (B E A D G)
Ab       at          //    four flats (B E A D)
Eb       every       //    three flats (B E A) 
Bb       bar         //    two flats (B E)
F        fidel       //    1 flat ... (B)


triads (make up your own mental associations that work for you)

FAC    = "fack"   as in "fack you"  // my mind works strange 
CEG    = "cegg"   like an egg
GBD
DFA    = dfa is a computer science theory term that I know
ACE    = "ace"    reminds me of top gun for some reason
EGB    = eddie's gone beserzk
BDF   

these patterns mostly hold for keys where root is sharp or flat as well

I don't memorize the sharps or flats up there yet, those will just come with time I feel
---
DFA, EGB, ACE have middle (third) sharped
BDF has both third and fifth sharped (B, D#, F#)
this is a post. there are many like it but this one is mine

=======================

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Last edited by mlfarrell at Oct 24, 2008,
#10
Quote by AXmichigan
yea im not sure about that
the circle of fifths is an awesome thing htat has alot of features with it

the one i found the most important (personally) are keys:
Keys are made up of 6 chords, you find a chord and move left one, then right one (from original one you chose). Both the major key and minor keys are part of that chord
try it out

Example: Key of G will have C, G, D & Am, Em Bm

And F# diminished
Thomas hopes to not have offended anyone with this post. No responsibility whatsoever is taken for any spelling or grammar mistakes, should there be any.

last.fm
#11
As for the initial post, that would be if you were trying to do a circle of fifth progression. You are totally misunderstanding the diagram. It's mainly used to determine closely related key signatures, which you could easily pull chords from or switch scales to for lead guitars. It doesn't tell you "okay, you can from a C chord, to a G chord, to a D chord, then for good measure an A chord" If you got that out of it, you definitely need to research it further.
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#12
Quote by Samothomas
And F# diminished


F# half diminished, though the triad would be diminished. There are no actual diminished modes in the natural major scale.
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#13
Quote by notsee
As for the initial post, that would be if you were trying to do a circle of fifth progression. You are totally misunderstanding the diagram. It's mainly used to determine closely related key signatures, which you could easily pull chords from or switch scales to for lead guitars. It doesn't tell you "okay, you can from a C chord, to a G chord, to a D chord, then for good measure an A chord" If you got that out of it, you definitely need to research it further.


Ok I know I don't have to go all one way with it but, if I start a song in key of C, can't I only play whats within one left, one right, minor and the major triads?
Last edited by ldiablo233 at Oct 24, 2008,
#14
Those would be the closely related keys, the two surrounding which ever surround the key you are playing in. But also you need to like into secondary dominants and stuff like that. Those would be the scale you can play leads over it with mostly. Sure you can easily transition to the new scale with no issues, but the main reason why that one note doesn't matter is generally because people don't hit it within the chords they are playing(referring to the one accidental in either closely related key) I haven't taught this stuff in a long time though, I'll end up having to refresh because I got a noob guitarist that I think is going to be my compadre. . . .
Quote by paranoid joker

Metal, should kick you in the nuts, after you catch it messing around with your girlfriend.
and then make a sandwhich in your house and walk out.


Http://www.myspace.com/drowningiris