#1
Hi all.

Im going to buy the marshall 2061 reissue soon, but from advice from members on this forum I will look at some clones first. I have the idea that if im going to buy a clone of something i want to at least save a little. So this leaves me choosing between the marshall ri and the ceriatone 20w lead and bass head. I have a hard time believing that it is as good or even better at one third of the marshalls price I LOVE the sound, the response and the string seperational qualities of the 2061.

Does someone have any experience with the two and pros and cons for both
#2
Screw Ceriatone. Get a Suhr Badger 18.


All Marshall tones with more features. Built in power scalling so you can drop the wattage of the amp to get cranked tones at lower levels.

Played one through a DR.Z cabinet and it was killer.
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#3
I really feel that the price tags on the suhrs are too high for my ecenomy Tho i WILL try one out just to see if i cant live without it But they are crazy epensive. The marshall is about as high as i can go moneywise
#4
Quote by chrisdam
I really feel that the price tags on the suhrs are too high for my ecenomy Tho i WILL try one out just to see if i cant live without it But they are crazy epensive. The marshall is about as high as i can go moneywise


My loca guitar stores carry both so that's absolutely not true.

Suhr Badger 18. 1500 bucks + change.

Marshall 2061X HW. 1800 bucks + change.
Quote by zgr0826
My culture is worthless and absolutely inferior to the almighty Leaf.


Quote by JustRooster
I incurred the wrath of the Association of White Knights. Specifically the Parent's Basement branch of service.
#5
wow.. here in denmark the 2061x is 10000 kroners which is roughly 2000 bucks, whereas the badger 18 is 15000 kroners, roughly 3000 bucks. : guess im outa luck for living here then
#6
Quote by chrisdam
wow.. here in denmark the 2061x is 10000 kroners which is roughly 2000 bucks, whereas the badger 18 is 15000 kroners, roughly 3000 bucks. : guess im outa luck for living here then


Sure are.


Try Ebay.
Quote by zgr0826
My culture is worthless and absolutely inferior to the almighty Leaf.


Quote by JustRooster
I incurred the wrath of the Association of White Knights. Specifically the Parent's Basement branch of service.
#7
i might.. But geez I real´ly LOVED the sound and EVERYTHING about the 2061. the simplicity. mmmm

But do you have any experience with the ceriatone? cuz i sure would like to save some money since as i said the marshall is stretching the budget i bit
#8
Well Ceriatone are great, highly recommended! Have you tried a 1974x (18watter) too? I have an 18watt clone from Brown Note. Most people prefer the 18watter over the 20watter.
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#9
Are you talking about the Marshall hand wired reissue? The Ceriatone is the same amp, only a lot cheaper. The HW series is pretty good, but seriously overpriced.

And I second what Gabe recommends, look at the 18 watter (Ceriatone makes a 1974 tmb which sounds great), I never really liked the 2061.
#11
also look at the 18 watt TMB

GREAT AMP

i got it in the 1x12 combo form with a gh12 heritage. Gabkits made my enclosure and it was flawless. Nik from Ceriatone does some of the best handwiring around and he is VERY good with answering customer questions. if you have questions he will almost always respond within the hour.
Gear:
2000 Paul Reed Smith CE-24
ESP EC-1000 w/ Seymour Duncans
Ceriatone 18 Watt TMB Plexi 1x12
Peavey 5150 2x12 Combo
#12
i have tried the 1974 combo, and its was amazing too, though i really do like the 2061 just a tad better. I will definately consider the ceriatone if it is just as good as the marshall thanx for all your replies. will the 18 watt be loud enough to use for gigs. We usually use PA anyways so really i see lower wattage as a huge advantage as one can crank it nearly everywhere. Thahts another reason why i prefer the 2061 over say a jtm45. and the 20 watts are still very loud, so should still be able to selfmonitor in bigger gigs too. Guess you guys have the same experience with the 18 watter?
#13
oh and al112987 yes i am talking about the hand wired reissue. Are you sure they will sound the same? cause the tone i got from the 2061 was THE tone ive been looking for
#14
The Ceriatone is also hand-wired and uses higher quality components. At the very least, it's not worse than the Marshall reissue. Second thing about the Ceriatone is that it's customizable, you can have a PPIMV installed easily when it's being built so that your amp is actually usable at low volumes.

The biggest beef I have with the 20 watter is that it doesn't have a TMB eq setup and dialing in a punchy low end is a little difficult (though I guess you could always just bridge the channels for that purpose)

The 18 watter certainly is loud enough for gigs, it's not really that it's quieter, but you'll get a quite a bit more gain from the 18 watter. Especially from the non-tremolo TMB. They're both loud. The 18 watter certainly has a unique feel to it because of the tube rectifier. Either way, I use a 35 watt JTM45 and I don't really find it TOO loud. You don't actually need to turn these amps to 10 for them to sound good, actually I'm not particularly fond of my amp's tone when it's turned to 10, I much prefer how it sounds around 6 or 7, when it can really clean up well with my guitar's volume knob.
Last edited by al112987 at Oct 18, 2008,
#15
Quote by Gabel
Well Ceriatone are great, highly recommended! Have you tried a 1974x (18watter) too? I have an 18watt clone from Brown Note. Most people prefer the 18watter over the 20watter.

+1
I'm gassing for an 18wTMB
But out of those, the Ceriatone by far.
#16
Quote by al112987
The Ceriatone is also hand-wired and uses higher quality components. At the very least, it's not worse than the Marshall reissue. Second thing about the Ceriatone is that it's customizable, you can have a PPIMV installed easily when it's being built so that your amp is actually usable at low volumes.

The biggest beef I have with the 20 watter is that it doesn't have a TMB eq setup and dialing in a punchy low end is a little difficult (though I guess you could always just bridge the channels for that purpose)

The 18 watter certainly is loud enough for gigs, it's not really that it's quieter, but you'll get a quite a bit more gain from the 18 watter. Especially from the non-tremolo TMB. They're both loud. The 18 watter certainly has a unique feel to it because of the tube rectifier. Either way, I use a 35 watt JTM45 and I don't really find it TOO loud. You don't actually need to turn these amps to 10 for them to sound good, actually I'm not particularly fond of my amp's tone when it's turned to 10, I much prefer how it sounds around 6 or 7, when it can really clean up well with my guitar's volume knob.


the lack of the eq is one of the things i like Thank you for your time and info. thats been a great help. I will soon be ordering either the 18watt head or the 20 from ceriatone. will post what i decide on and give a sort of review of it
#17
Quote by chrisdam
Hi all.

Im going to buy the marshall 2061 reissue soon, but from advice from members on this forum I will look at some clones first. I have the idea that if im going to buy a clone of something i want to at least save a little. So this leaves me choosing between the marshall ri and the ceriatone 20w lead and bass head. I have a hard time believing that it is as good or even better at one third of the marshalls price I LOVE the sound, the response and the string seperational qualities of the 2061.

Does someone have any experience with the two and pros and cons for both



The ceriatone is a much better amp than the marshall reissue.

The downside of Ceriatone is that they are in Malaysia so shipping is very expensive and they are built with asian parts. They are hi end asian parts but still not as high end as the German and American parts that you would get in more expensive DIY amp kits or from other boutiques.

The upside to Ceriatone is that they use higher quality components than marshall which gives you a better sounding amp.

The downside to Marshall is that they use the cheapest Chinese parts available (not good for tone) and they have a very big price tag.

The upside of the Marshall is that you don't have to wait for it to be build and shipped from Malaysia

EDIT: BTW, What country are you in?
Not taking any online orders.
Last edited by CorduroyEW at Oct 19, 2008,
#18
Quote by CorduroyEW
The ceriatone is a much better amp than the marshall reissue.

The downside of Ceriatone is that they are in Malaysia so shipping is very expensive and they are built with asian parts. They are hi end asian parts but still not as high end as the German and American parts that you would get in more expensive DIY amp kits or from other boutiques.

The upside to Ceriatone is that they use higher quality components than marshall which gives you a better sounding amp.

The downside to Marshall is that they use the cheapest Chinese parts available (not good for tone) and they have a very big price tag.

The upside of the Marshall is that you don't have to wait for it to be build and shipped from Malaysia

EDIT: BTW, What country are you in?


Truth be told i have a hard time imagining anything sounding better than the 2061 SO if thats the case with the ceriatone well then its amazing Since you have one, you might be able to tell me whether the ceriatone will feel the same to play as the marshall. cause I really liked the sensitivity and the relative quick reaction combined with the vintage tone, not to mention string seperation being the best ive ever heard even with lots of gain from a booster

I live in denmark, and would love to try one out before making the purchase but realize that is damn near impossible
Last edited by chrisdam at Oct 19, 2008,
#19
Thats a really tough one. Things like note separation can very greatly from one amp to the next even if they are the same brand. The reason for the variation is beca use an amps electrolytic capacitors are usually rated at + or - 20% which is a huge variance! If an amp has power filters that have 20% more capacitance you are going to have a clearer more touch sensitive amp than you would have if your power filters are 20% smaller than the stated value

The Marshall has a better transformer than the Ceriatone which doese make it more responsive but the Ceriatone has better capacitors which give it a sweeter fuller tone that is better, and more in tune, at high volume. If I were going to choose between the 2 I would get the Ceriatone but replace the transformers with Mojo Transformers. Doing that would still cost you less than buying the Marshall and yeah, it would be just responsive as the Marshall if not more so.

You you could always buy a 18watt 1974 combo from me. I could add a solid state rectifier which would boost the output and clarity into the same range as the 2061.
Not taking any online orders.
Last edited by CorduroyEW at Oct 19, 2008,
#20
I'd recommend Heyboer or Mercury Magnetics as well for output transformers, though it's not as if Nik's sound bad or anything.
#21
^Heyboer are good... In fact Mojo transformer are Heyboer. If you go to Heyboers audio transformer page they just tell you to talk to Mojo. In my opinion they are the best transformers out there. I agree that the transformers Nik uses are still nice and don't really NEED to be replaced but if you have the money and are looking for the best possible tone...
Not taking any online orders.
#22
Quote by CorduroyEW
Thats a really tough one. Things like note separation can very greatly from one amp to the next even if they are the same brand. The reason for the variation is beca use an amps electrolytic capacitors are usually rated at + or - 20% which is a huge variance! If an amp has power filters that have 20% more capacitance you are going to have a clearer more touch sensitive amp than you would have if your power filters are 20% smaller than the stated value

The Marshall has a better transformer than the Ceriatone which doese make it more responsive but the Ceriatone has better capacitors which give it a sweeter fuller tone that is better, and more in tune, at high volume. If I were going to choose between the 2 I would get the Ceriatone but replace the transformers with Mojo Transformers. Doing that would still cost you less than buying the Marshall and yeah, it would be just responsive as the Marshall if not more so.

You you could always buy a 18watt 1974 combo from me. I could add a solid state rectifier which would boost the output and clarity into the same range as the 2061.


geez thanx alot. Very important info, and makes me more likely to choose an amp i can actually try before buying. Money is ofcourse an issue speaking against the marshall, though i am determined to get an amp ill actually keep for more than a month or so this time Also i just talked to nik and the delivery time will be around 4 weeks plus a week of shipment. This is not really going to cut it for me, since i have a pretty important gig comming up in three weeks time.
I do believe that the ceriatone has the potential to be the better and ofcourse the cheaper of the two. though the 2061 i tried in the local shop is JUST what ive been looking for tone and response wise. Everything is perfect on it except the price. Thanx alot for the info. Would really suck to wait 5 weeks, have bad tone for the big gig comming up, and then recieve an amp that doesnt live up to my expectations

But just a last question before i decide finally: How much would tbe other tranny's be? Though they should not have anything to do with string seperation should they?
#23
i would personally love to buy a ceriatone amp, there are only 2 things that keep me from doing it.
1. takes too long. i need instant gratification
2. they dont offer clones of the amp i want.
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#24
Quote by chrisdam
geez thanx alot. Very important info, and makes me more likely to choose an amp i can actually try before buying. Money is ofcourse an issue speaking against the marshall, though i am determined to get an amp ill actually keep for more than a month or so this time Also i just talked to nik and the delivery time will be around 4 weeks plus a week of shipment. This is not really going to cut it for me, since i have a pretty important gig comming up in three weeks time.
I do believe that the ceriatone has the potential to be the better and ofcourse the cheaper of the two. though the 2061 i tried in the local shop is JUST what ive been looking for tone and response wise. Everything is perfect on it except the price. Thanx alot for the info. Would really suck to wait 5 weeks, have bad tone for the big gig comming up, and then recieve an amp that doesnt live up to my expectations

But just a last question before i decide finally: How much would tbe other tranny's be? Though they should not have anything to do with string seperation should they?


The paper bobbin transformers give you tighter bass and more top end sizzle which does change not seperation a little. The Mojo Transformers will cost you about $152.00 USD plus shipping (another $80 to $90). I might be able to get you a slightly better deal too but they still won't be cheap. The output transformer is without a doubt the most important for tone and you can get one of those for about $65 plus around $60 shipping. Again I can probably get you a better deal on that if you don't mind waiting untill I make my next order.
Not taking any online orders.
#25
Quote by chrisdam
geez thanx alot. Very important info, and makes me more likely to choose an amp i can actually try before buying. Money is ofcourse an issue speaking against the marshall, though i am determined to get an amp ill actually keep for more than a month or so this time Also i just talked to nik and the delivery time will be around 4 weeks plus a week of shipment. This is not really going to cut it for me, since i have a pretty important gig comming up in three weeks time.
I do believe that the ceriatone has the potential to be the better and ofcourse the cheaper of the two. though the 2061 i tried in the local shop is JUST what ive been looking for tone and response wise. Everything is perfect on it except the price. Thanx alot for the info. Would really suck to wait 5 weeks, have bad tone for the big gig comming up, and then recieve an amp that doesnt live up to my expectations

But just a last question before i decide finally: How much would tbe other tranny's be? Though they should not have anything to do with string seperation should they?


Again, it's hard to talk about string separation in terms of specific parts, but what things like clarity, etc. are all byproducts of the amp's circuit as well as the parts being used. An output transformer certainly affects the tone and feel quite a bit as it is the single most important component to a tube amplifier. Other things that affect things like clarity and string separation are coupling caps and filter caps. New "vintage style Marshalls" in general tend to sound a bit muddy and a bit harsh on the high end because many of the components need burn in time. The coupling capacitors in particularly need about 30-40 hours of burn-in before sounding their best.

But a Heyboer output tranny would be around $150 and MM output tranny would be around $200-250 (they're a bit overpriced though). It's not uncommon for people to buy their own OTs and have Nik at Ceriatone build them an amp using their self-bought OT. I've seen Nik's lead dressing work, it's really quite impressive. Much better looking than the gutshot's I've seen of Marshall's HW line.

Overall, I still recommend the Ceriatone over the Marshall as you are getting a superior amp for a lower price. The HW series is very good but it is not uncommon for people to buy them and completely re-do the board themselves using higher end components and a new OT.
#26
Actually Marshall's HW are notirious for having reliabilty issues, especially the transofrmers, which are by far the most expensive parts are prone to breaking.
Quote by stratman_13
It's okay Gabel. You kick ass.



18watter video demo

My band

Recognised by the Official EG/GG&A Who To Listen To List 2009
#27
I've never heard of their reliability issue but it wouldn't surprise me as I'm certain that their trannies are not as good as most aftermarket clones. Their lead dress is a bit underwhelming too imo. It's very hard to mass produce handwired amps without losing out on quality control. Though I have seen some amps better wired than others. Though I certainly feel like I could do a better job than most of the cases I've seen.
#28
Quote by Gabel
Actually Marshall's HW are notirious for having reliabilty issues, especially the transofrmers, which are by far the most expensive parts are prone to breaking.


I haven't heard about reliability issues with transformers on the Marshall HW's. I guess I heard of people having problems with the OT when they hook their amp up to a powerbreak but they do warn you about that in their paperwork, or at least they used to.

Quote by al112987
But a Heyboer output tranny would be around $150


That can't be right. I pay less than that for both the OT and the Power Tranny. I'm not getting that good a deal am I?
Not taking any online orders.
Last edited by CorduroyEW at Oct 19, 2008,
#29
theres youtube videos demonstrating the 18 watt ceriatone
Gear:
2000 Paul Reed Smith CE-24
ESP EC-1000 w/ Seymour Duncans
Ceriatone 18 Watt TMB Plexi 1x12
Peavey 5150 2x12 Combo
#30
Quote by CorduroyEW
I haven't heard about reliability issues with transformers on the Marshall HW's. I guess I heard of people having problems with the OT when they hook their amp up to a powerbreak but they do warn you about that in their paperwork, or at least they used to.


This does aplly to the 18watter I know. I knwos there are tons of threads on 18watt.com with poeple getting a blown OT. It's very common on those amps and quite common for the other HWs.
Quote by stratman_13
It's okay Gabel. You kick ass.



18watter video demo

My band

Recognised by the Official EG/GG&A Who To Listen To List 2009
#31
Quote by CorduroyEW
I haven't heard about reliability issues with transformers on the Marshall HW's. I guess I heard of people having problems with the OT when they hook their amp up to a powerbreak but they do warn you about that in their paperwork, or at least they used to.


That can't be right. I pay less than that for both the OT and the Power Tranny. I'm not getting that good a deal am I?


It might depend on the transformer then. My JTM45 tranny cost around $130, it might be cheaper for other amps, less iron for smaller trannies.
#32
Yeah a pair for an 18watter (Heyboer) cost me $150 (included in my kit though).
Quote by stratman_13
It's okay Gabel. You kick ass.



18watter video demo

My band

Recognised by the Official EG/GG&A Who To Listen To List 2009