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it won't hurt the pedal. it won't hurt the amp. on a solid state amp, only use it on the clean channel, trying to boost SS distortion with an OD pedal isn't a good idea, it will make a nasty sound of feedback garbage.

what is it you're trying to achieve? if you're just looking for a classic rock tone through your SS amp, then a TS could possibly do it. but if you're looking to tighten or boost your gain, it's not gonna work well. that pretty much only works positively for valve amps.

you're better off just waiting to get a valve amp and not buy an OD til after you have one and decided you still need an OD.
i think they should have just ditched the pickguard...looks too cheesy. the wood grain on both sides is beautiful...don't distract from it...though i think LPs without pickguards look better with carved tops...hmm...not bad Gibson, if you could just take away that damn half retarded crescent shit
^fair enough, i don't think anyone's gonna change anyone's minds in here anyway. just trying to argue some statements in a friendly manner is all.

on topic: the guitar looks alright but nothing special, i'd love to try it though. i think they should have promoted it in The Hangover though, that would have been amazing...fighting the tiger off with the Dusk Tiger guitar! helllll yeaaahhhhh!!!
Quote by i_am_metalhead
I DO wear whatever is clean. Matching has never been a priority to me. I'm not out to impress anyone. If people want to judge me based on my appearance then let them, its only a sign of their own insecurities.

I drive a 22-year-old car with rust spots, missing hub-caps, and spray painted graffiti . I could get a better car but I personally don't care what people think of me.

I had to grow up with next to nothing, I've worked manual labor jobs for minimum wage, and I've served in the US Army. I've learned to appreciate the things I have and not want for anything other than the bare minimum. Sorry if my beliefs seem strange or unusual to you.


well that's fine that you've learned to get by with just the bare minimum and still do that, as far as your own needs go, but that's not how every single person works obviously. there are plenty of us that have grown up with next to nothing and have worked for what we own today, it doesn't make us any less of a person to care about what we look like. i care, i care about what i look like and the condition of the things i own, not b/c i'm afraid others will look at me and think 'hmph', but b/c i'm no longer a boy, i'm a man and i need to look presentable for a plethora of reasons. you were in the army so you know how they regard your visual appearance, b/c they-like the other branches-hold you accountable as a representation of the kind of people you are compared to the average joe. military are expected to be clean, wear neat clothes when on duty, and very organized and clean cut. it's a sign of your professionalism. going out wearing neon green leggings with blue and yellow striped shirt makes you look like an ass to just about everyone, whether it fits you or not. there are times when you gotta suck it up and look like a grown up professional with some taste. you already know this b/c this is part of the mentality of the military, which i respect.

and in regards to your car having rust spots...maybe you should eventually look into another car just for the sake of it not falling apart? rust spots only spread if you don't take care of them soon enough, and eventually it won't matter that your car can get to point A and B if it can't do it in one piece lol. not a knock at you or your car here, just saying that a little problem like that is bound to expand. sometimes buying the bare essentials will leave whatever you bought susceptible to dangers that would otherwise be protected against with something that cost more...
i don't think anyone here is trying to say it's right, i_am_metalhead, we're just saying that that's how society is. we get that YOU don't let things like that play hardly any role in your decisions, but you can't deny that the majority of people do. i don't think anyone's trying to convince you of anything other than the fact that majority of people want a guitar to look good if they're going to be paying a good amount for it.

some of your statements make it seem like we shouldn't care about wearing clothes that even match or drive anything that does anymore than meet the bare essentials of our driving necessities. you can't tell me you're gonna go out looking like a clown as long as your clothes fit and are clean, and you can't tell me that if you have the money to shop around that you're going to get a car that just drives on doughnut wheels with no paint finish and no A/C, power steering or anything that makes it look REMOTELY interesting to at least yourself. something tells me that you dress a certain way that reflects who you are, and you'd drive something that reflected who you are as well. and even if that transportation is very simple, it will still reflect YOU, being a minimalist in your needs. but unless it just has the functions necessary to move and turn and not break down, it's kinda making your point contradictory.

slash_edit: wow this has derailed big time. in fact, now there's THREE arguments going on. one about playability<or>aesthetics, and one about whether or not a lower priced copy could rival a true Gibby, and one about whether or not looks matter at ALL with ANYTHING in society.

though, personally, a girl can be as sweet as the sunset, and able to reproduce and live a lifetime with me, but if she's the world's worst trainwreck in the looks department, i'm gonna go with the girl that can give me all that AND look damn fine.
well i've played a handful of gibsons, including a good friend's Studio. i wouldn't be as dumb to say i could take his Studio model, i loved it, it's a big reason why a Gibby is my dream guitar. but i've played some faded series....and i can't say that their playability was anything fantastic, they played fairly the same as mid range guitar. with a full set up, i'm sure they'll play fantastic, but so will most other guitars outside the low end range. and as far as tone goes, they had great tone, they didn't have the Gibby pups that i would have preferred, so the tone wasn't as great as it could have been. but the tone was still lacking. i really can't honestly comment on how the tone of my LP would compare until i get pro level pups in there. i don't think it's totally asinine that a higher end Agile or Epi could beat a lower end Gibson. if not, then i don't think people would be doing it, i think all pros would only be using the biggest name brands. i don't think this is an argument that'll ever be settled, it's all subjective.
Quote by Lt. Shinysides
Seriously. Agile and Epi are good guitars for the money, but you need to pull your head out of your ass if you think that they are even half as good as a true Gibson. Even with upgrades to the electronics, you cannot replace the guitar's wood, and you cannot replace the human hands that built it.


damn man, you just made me feel like dick for thinking my AL-3000 could ever sound as good as a Gibson. i think it's taking it a tad far to say they can't even be HALF as good. i wouldn't say it's half as good as a custom or an older standard, but compared to today's lower end Gibsons, i think my Agile stands a good chance in the tone department. what do i know. i've played both, i've noticed the differences, what validity do i have in saying that for me, my Agile can compete with some of those Gibbys.

Quote by i_am_metalhead
Anyone would care greatly about their living conditions, but to care about what your method of transportation looks like is a bit asinine, imho.


this is very true, yet that's how it is in our world today...usually when money is a huge issue, looks don't matter, just working transportation does. but when you get a lot more money to play with, chances are you're going to go for frills and looks to compliment the performance. not saying YOU personally, i'm saying the average person.
well that's a bad analogy for YOU then. a lot of people will agree that once they have the money to really SHOP for a car, rather than just get something that is reliable and works, that they'll get something that pleases them visually as well. there's nothing crazy or absurd about it. i see great points from both sides of the fence here, including ones you've made, but i know there's tons of guitarists (experienced/noob/intermediate, all of em) that take looks into consideration.
personally, i'm a guy that let's aesthetics play more than just a teeny tiny role in my guitar purchases. tone comes FIRST. but after i hear that a guitar is good and plays good, and has the potential to sound better with modding, i start looking at it's appearance. truth be told, i want a guitar that fits my personality and my 'look' so to say. i couldn't see myself using one of those Steinburgers as my own guitar (unless i found a REALLLLY cheap deal or got one for free) b/c it's just not my taste, and i know they sound AMAZING.

isn't it safe to use the car analogy again? guitars are similar to cars. we want one that gets the job done, when it's cheap we don't expect as much aesthetics and luxuries, but when it's more expensive we want it to look better than just 'ok', and we want it to match us in a way...i don't advocate purchasing a guitar solely on it's looks, but i think looks are the last part in my determining factor, which COULD make or break a deal on a much more expensive guitar. it's not about pleasing the audience or whoever sees you with it (do audiences even CARE what it looks like? i believe they see ANYthing with 6 strings and go 'oooooh! guitar!!! hot!!'), it's about seeing something that when you look at it, you fall in love with the appearance as much as the tone.

everytime i see my LP, my vision gets distorted and i hear 'Dream Weaver' in the background
i do have my own opinion, and my opinion is that the radio doesn't play anything heavy enough vocal wise or sound wise that i want to call metal. and my comment on behemoth was just merely stating i dunno how everyone here views them, but i loved what i heard so far, so if yall hate em, don't bash me for loving what i've heard. i have no problem generating my own opinion.

posts are appreciated though.
just so you know, a 5 watt valve amp will do GnR sounds good, but not nearly as good as a higher wattage EL34 powered amp will. you'll have that crunch, but it'll definitely be fizzy and not as full as a bigger amp with the marshall voicing. just something to keep in mind.

i'd suggest waiting til you can buy a valve amp that you can actually crank more than just once in blue moon, otherwise it's being underused if you ask me. a really good modeler or POD with headphones could get you by for now i think.

that's just me...if you can at least get 1/4 volume when playing on a 5 watt british voiced amp, as well as an OD to push it into GnR style gain, then i think you could be happy enough, but if not, you'll just be getting a fraction of the greatness that is an all valve amp.
ha, i've used that thread for a couple bands, in fact that's where i got into CoB. only problem is, it can recommend bands of a certain style, but it can't recommend other songs by that SPECIFIC band that are similar to the songs already mentioned or songs that i like...get what i mean?

feel like a dick for making this thread now ha...maybe someone will understand what i mean. as of right now i'm just downloading random songs and if i like them, i keep em, if they're not my thing i just delete them.

anyway, if this thread is completely dumb then i guess a mod will close it. i'm just feeling pretty lost lol, REAL metal isn't where i'm familiar with, which is why i'm trying to get specific suggestions i guess.
i'm trying to get into darker metal, less of a mainstream sound (i hate that stuff for the most part, only a few bands i can tolerate), but anyway i've been getting into Behemoth and Cannibal Corpse very recently, and i'm trying to find more recommendations of songs by these guys that are similar to the songs i already have-which i really like

so far my favorite Cannibal Corpse song is Evisceration Plauge. vocals are deep and brutal, but i can still understand the singer well. heavy tone and just full of energy. i want more songs like this...i've also got Hammersmashed face, I will kill you and ****ed with a knife.

i don't even know how behemoth ranks in the world of metal, whether they're looked down upon or not, but from what i've heard so far i love the sound and my favorite tune from them is Inner Sanctum. also have Sculpting the throne/septh, Conquer All, Inflamed with Rage, and Slaves shall server...

i'm a metal noob. i'm big on CoB and now i'm getting into more darker metal and i guess lesser known stuff (as far as radio goes anyway), and i just want some brutal shit that i can understand the vocals, and the songs have some interesting twists as well as kick the shit out of my bass.

if i sound like a complete twat from this thread, my apologies.
so i have an offer for trading my DL-8 for the MM4, which has chorus (the only thing i really care about getting) as well as a few other modulation FX.

how's the pedal? i imagine it's pretty good, but i want to know UG's opinion. even if all i use it for is chorus, how will it handle? i don't want a tone sucker, and i don't want something that'll affect my amp's sound at all when it's off.

opinions? seems like a good deal, but i'll wait for a few responses...though 'go for it, i have one and love it' type responses won't do me much use. thanks
i find it odd that everyone's suggesting coil tapping over coil splitting in here for versatility, when coil tapping doesn't change the sound nearly as much as coil splitting does...maybe i'm missing something...

TS, i still recommend to coil split and not coil tap, that's how you're gonna get closer to a single coil sound (without actual single coils, that is)
oh and just adding another bit of opinion in here...but i'd feel really discouraged from owning an amp that needed two noise gates for whatever reason...it's different when you're a pro and got people setting your stuff up all the time, but on your own you start to want the least amount of hassle as possible eventually. ONE noisegate doesn't seem like much hassle, but when you're having to hook things up in the front and back of your amp to keep it from getting out of control, it can just get discouraging. it IS possible that getting an amp like the spider valve would be beneficial to you, though for a while you'll feel like you've taken a leap backwards considering your current amp.

i love that i can take my amp and pretty much plug straight into it, or at least into a pedal or two and all of that into the front and have a tone that i love...when i have to start messing with putting stuff in both the front AND back, that starts making it feel like less of a jamming/gigging amp, and more of a studio/gigging amp...if you know what i mean....and i'd prefer the earlier of the two if i had to choose lol.

though, TS, if you're thinking of switching to a more versatility-oriented amp, check out the Vettas and Flextones before the spider valves, it seems (from what i've read anyway) that the Vettas are at the top of the tone dept., with flextones and spider valves almost at a tie for second. you don't have to have valves to have good tone, Line 6 has proved this already with the Vetta and Flextone.
only prob is that i don't think he's trying to get a standard OD tone on his amp, i think he's wanting to boost the overdrive channel to better cope with his metal tones, which probably won't go as well on the valvestate's gain channel as it would on a valve amp's gain channel.

i dunno, i still think the TS using an OD pedal on top of the valvestate's gain for heavier metal will just get him a lot of feedback and not much improvement at all
an LP can be extremely versatile in the right hands, even without coil splitting. picking dynamics and volume/tone knobs will make a huge difference. i'm not saying it is THE most versatile, but it's definitely a lot more versatile than most think, until they themselves have owned one for a while and played all the styles mentioned.

that said, i'm planning on coil splitting mine when i upgrade pickups so that i can get a better twang on funkier styles, i just love the feel of an LP...it's heavy and you can feel the power of it in it's weight alone almost...yet it can still be gentle and tame all the same time. it's great playing hard and rough on an LP b/c you don't feel as much like you're gonna break it as you would on a lighter bodied guitar like a strat or something. . . not that you would break those either, it's just a feeling that's all.

it's too hard to say which is most versatile...i love strats, teles, SGs and LPs...but i've loved my LP the most so far

slash_edit: also, DON'T waste time on coil tapping...it doesn't do nearly as good a job of getting a single coil sound (if that's not what it's supposed to do then i have no idea what the hell it's for i guess) as coil SPLITTING does, which actually deactivates one of the coils in the humbucker.
dunno how much help i can be atm, but those guys at the show probably got to crank their amps, which probably helped the overall sound. how often do you get to crank your amp?

also, are you 100% sure they didn't have ANYTHING else other than guitar into amps? i don't find it hard to believe that the spider valves can sound great with tweaking, especially for metal. though i imagine those guys in the band are probably also really tight on their playing, hence why they sound so good. it's all of them together playing really well....one person in an entire band that sounds good on their own is kind of useless if everyone else only sounds ok or not so good...
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
It just is so skewed and f*cked up that it makes my brain hurt. Like a Salvador Dali painting or something.


Or that 3 boobed mutant from Total Recall.
christ all mighty, that's how much this thread has derailed. it's prolly b/c i mentioned her in panties lol
i was fortunate enough that my gma paid half of my first decent practice amp, and then put my G-400 (first REAL electric guitar, before that just a 100 dollar firstact strat knockoff with one humbucker) on layaway and i got it like 5 months later...and i bought my AD30VT on my own with saved up cash, then one of my bros was pullin' in good ass money for a couple years at his former job and bought me a lot of stuff along the way, the ultimate bit being my Randall RM50 two Decembers ago...also gave me a guitar that a friend gave him when he intended to learn which i traded for a pedal eventually. anyway, other than that, i spent my own money on my gear by saving up in addition to selling old gear acquired through bdays and xmas's.

so yeah, i know what it's like to start off real slow and then build up to something you deserve and finally feel like, 'well...now i'm finally starting to get somewhere'

though there will always be someone who gets much nicer stuff much faster, and someone who gets only partially better stuff MUCH slower in comparison to ourselves
sorry but i like my girls thick. put some more meat on the ass and double Cs that aren't very far from Ds, and then we're talking. though she IS about as white as that haha...maybe i can sneak a pic or two tomorrow when she's chillin' here at my house haha. i better not check this thread tomorrow while she's around...
nah, Suburban Rhythm...all 5 or so styles of the song hahaha...last song on the first disc of the double disc live album.
Quote by AcousticMirror
i like that she likes the feeling of going commando.


THAT part is OVER....
(said in the manner of Reel Big Fish's frontman at the end of S.R. in the live album)
^kinda hoping someone here knows what i'm talking about lol...everytime i hear that part after the song i crack up...those guys are hilarious when they're rambling btw songs...
you would probably want a distortion pedal and use it on your clean channel. clean channel for cleans (obviously), set your amp's gain channel for mid-gain rock, and then dist. on clean channel for heaviest of tones.

it doesn't seem like you'll be going for a tube amp anytime soon, which i'm not hassling you for, i understand that there is a hierarchy of necessity when it comes to money and not having much for what we wish we could. anyway, if you'd be getting a tube amp within the next couple months, then i'd say just hold off and intend to buy an OD pedal, but if not (which sounds like it's the case) then just go ahead and buy a really good distortion pedal.

the only distortion pedal i ever owned was the digitech death metal...it was my second pedal ever, and i got it before i ever joined these forums i think and was under the impression that all good guitarists had a bunch of pedals, including a distortion-even though it was completely unnecessary for me. anyway, that pedal was only good at lower volumes and for scooped hi gain metal tone...so it was pretty much useless. don't get it. i'll let more experienced distortion pedal users advise you on what to get.

good luck!
^that amp reminds me of a really big church...in fact it reminds me of the Catholic church i used to go to back when i was a lazy christian...in fact it's the only catholic church in my town AFAIK...wierd
absolutely. can't make much of a statement if you can't even show that you got your own style.
TS, if you really want one of the best LPs you can get without getting near the higher spectrum of your budget, get an AL-3000 or higher model from rondomusic.com

i LOVE mine. it's such a beautiful guitar, and the ONLY thing i dislike about it are the stock pups. but that's expected for a $400 guitar. with a couple hundred you could buy yourself some sick pups to stick in that bad boy, and then have a pro set it up for you (or set it up yourself if you know how), and STILL stay under 700 USD. i'm a bang-for-your-buck kinda guy though, that's why i suggest this. if you have good technique, and a great amp, then you're gonna sound good with your guitar regardless, so don't let the low price fool you into thinking it won't sound good.

though, if you REALLY want a Gibby or Tokai right now, then don't stray from your dream just b/c of me. my dream guitar is a Gibby LP of course, but i'm patient enough to wait til i have all my other gear necessities taken care of before spending so much on a Gibby that i have to wait a long time before i can even afford to buy new pedals/pups/amp upgrades.

long story short, i believe that if you don't already have a bunch of other things you'll need to buy for your rig in the near future, go for the Gibby or jap clone LP. if not, then go with an Agile b/c you'll love it just the same i promise, only difference is that you'll prolly keep the Agile later down the road not only b/c it's a great guitar, but b/c it won't hold it's value like a Gibby will (hey...a Gibby is a Gibby..), and one day if you feel like upgrading guitars that Gibby holding more percentage of it's value will be beneficial. though i don't really plan on getting rid of my Agile ever, and i can live with that.
the only thing wrong with that marshall is the logo being in the worst position possible, correct? if not, i'm definitely missing whatever else is really wrong with it lol. it's been a long day at work, guys...
money to burn, and you're in a cover band, hahaha. but i think we've all been there...where we though it'd be cool to be just like our heros. hell...i STILL think it'd be cool to be my favorite guitarists...just like our favorite guitarists feel about THEIR favorites'...but i'm smart enough now to know that it's even cooler to create your own vibe and style
lol i'm just waiting for the TS to get back to us on what he's wanting to know the string size for specifically...can't help that we're burning time in a good way haha. i guess i'll stop talking about it then...

btw, i have no prob showin' off my gf's junk in the trunk, which is equally as sexy as what she's packin' on her chest, but over the internet is a bad idea, especially if she were to accidentally stumble upon a familiar pic on the google images in a few weeks LMAO.
Quote by ragingkitty
I get where you're coming from, though I never did like the view of my ex-girlfriends in g strings... they just look so uncomfortable. I always preferred a girl in panties....


well i definitely don't mind the panties...though on her ass, which is insanely round for a white girl, they fight to stay covering even 3/4 of the cheeks haha...oh well, she accidentally bought some the other day in a rush and didn't find out til she got home that they were...a thong...so now i may be THAT much closer to seeing her in a thong.

err...yea...officially de-railed when i start publicly talking about my gf's ass...sorry guys, no pics in case someone decides to post 'pics or it didn't happen'
i actually wouldn't mind having that coconut one if i knew how to play some island music and had an electric ukulele...in fact, i'd be the shit if that was the case
Quote by ragingkitty
Why do you guys assume she actually wears anything underneath? Who knows, maybe she likes the feel of going commando?


maybe she does wear panties but hates g-strings...my gf has an ass BUILT for those kinds of panties but pretty much refuses to wear them...so maybe that chick's the same...now i'm depressed realizing that my gf's ass won't likely be seen in a thong...what a waste...
spaceballx, it's amazing how this one question from you can give insight to how you look at achieving a certain tone...

anyway, there's no definite rule for what string size ANY guitarist HAS to use for any given style, but generally 9s-10s work just fine for standard E tuning, 10s-11s for drop D and Eb tuning, 11s-12s for Drop C. that's MY personal little guideline, no one has to follow it but i find it works rather well. if you don't plan on doing any bends or much lead style, pretty much just sticking to chord based rhythm for the most part, it wouldn't hurt to even go as far as one size higher for any given style.

when you drop tune you have to compensate for the slackened strings by getting a thicker string guage, otherwise it's like playing with spaghetti noodles and you'll have too much rattle and flub.

now that i've said that, don't buy a certain string size if you're only going to be using the size to it's potential for the most part, so in other words don't buy really thick strings if you're gonna be in standard or just drop D most the time, otherwise you'll be messing your guitar's intonation up.

sorry, but from your OP i just get the feeling that you'd be down to buying every exact piece of gear they have and have everything set like them and expect to sound the same...but anyway that's just an opinion. hope this helped.
ha sorry for sounding dumb, but when you refer to putting it in my HiFi if it doesn't make the rig sound good, do you mean my stereo system or something?
buying and then selling around here doesn't happen very fast, it's not that there aren't a lot of musicians, it's that there aren't a lot that really invest much into their gear. it takes a while to even get someone interested in your gear.

anyway, i'm just wondering if this thing will sound as good as a stompbox EQ, even if that means putting it through the FX loop. though i always figured EQs sounded better in front of the amp. further insight would be appreciated, but thanks for the responses so far!

slash_edit: when i say 'around here' i definitely mean my town, not UG