# Major Scale Modes

It is September the second, day two of CPDmusic's lesson writing marathon, and we are going to start off by looking at the basic major scale modes. Enjoy!

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Intro: Hello everybody, and welcome to the second lesson of CPDmusic's Lesson Writing Marathon! If you don't what CPDmusic's lesson writing marathon is, check it out here. It is September the second, and we are going to start off by looking at the basic major scale modes. Enjoy! Review of the Major Scale: Before we start looking at modes of the major scale, lets review the major scale itself, in the key of C: C D E F G A B C Okay, now that we have that down, I will also give you this scale in a numerical sequence. This is much like my chord theory lesson, in the sense that the numbers are always in relation to the major scale: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 Let's also, before we get started, review C major scale on the guitar itself:
```E||----------------------|----------------------||
B||----------------------|------------0----1----||
G||----------------------|--0----2--------------||
D||-------0----2----3----|----------------------||
A||--3-------------------|----------------------||
E||----------------------|----------------------||```
That's really all we will need to review for the purposes of this lesson. Besides, if you are learning major scale modes, you probably have a pretty firm grasp of the major scale by now. One other thing you should notice is that the standard major scale is often referred to as the Ionian Mode. What is a Mode? What is a major mode? Well, by definition, it is a scale that encompasses the same set of diatonic intervals as the major scale, while the tonic differs. In other words, it's a scale that has the same notes as a given major scale, but the root note it different. This will become more clear as we go along. The Dorian Mode: The second mode of the major scale is the Dorian mode (remember the standard major or Ionian mode is the first). The Dorian mode follows this numerical sequence: 1 2 b3 4 5 6 b7 8 As you can see, this is actually a fair bit different from the major scale. There are four flattened notes; the second, third, fifth, and seventh notes. So, if we were to flatten the second, third, fifth, and seventh notes of the C major scale, we would get the C Dorian mode, which would go like this: C D Eb F G A Bb C So, it would be played on the guitar like this:
```E||----------------------|----------------------||
B||----------------------|-----------------1----||
Ite G||----------------------|--0----2----3---------||
D||-------0----1----3----|----------------------||
A||--3-------------------|----------------------||
E||----------------------|----------------------||```
It kind of seems a little random, doesn't it? It almost seems as if someone just randomly said flatten the E and the B!. Well, there is actually some sense behind it! To understand this, we must look at the D Dorian Scale, instead of the C. Lets start with a D major scale: D E F# G A B C# D Now, as we know, a Dorian mode is a major scale with a b3 and b7. So, if we flatten the third and seventh note of the major scale, we get this: D E F G A B C D Do you see it? Remember our definition of a mode; it's a scale that has the same notes as a given scale, with a different root. So look, the D Dorian has the same notes as the C major scale; C D E F G A B C. It just starts and ends on D! In that sense, the C Ionian Mode (remember, the Ionian mode is just the standard major scale) is almost the same as the D Dorian Mode (I say almost because I don't want to get hardcore music theorists on my back!) The Phrygian Mode: The third mode of the major scale is the Phrygian Mode. It follows this numerical sequence in relation to the Major scale: 1 b2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8 So, looking at this, we can determine that the Phrygian mode is quite different than the Major scale, with four flat notes. You may also note that two of the flats are the same as the two flats in the Dorian mode. So, if we were to construct a C Phrygian Mode, we would flatten the second, third, sixth, and seventh notes in the major scale to get this: C Db Eb F G Ab Bb C And it would be played on the guitar like this:
```E||----------------------|----------------------||
B||----------------------|-----------------1----||
G||----------------------|--0----1----3---------||
D||------------1----3----|----------------------||
A||--3----4--------------|----------------------||
E||----------------------|----------------------||```
Once again, it may seem kind of random. But, remember how we made a D Dorian mode, and saw the relationship. Well now, we are going to make an E Phrygian Mode. So, lets take the E major scale: E F# G# A B C# D# E And we will flatten the second, third, sixth, and seventh notes: E F G A B C D E As you will see, it has the same notes as the C major scale, it just starts and ends on E. It would be played on the guitar like this:
```E||----------------------|-----------------0----||
B||----------------------|--0----1----3---------||
G||------------0----2----|----------------------||
D||--2----3--------------|----------------------||
A||----------------------|----------------------||
E||----------------------|----------------------||```
Now, since the pattern is quite apparent now, we will skip constructing the remaining modes in C for the sake of time. It was just to give you an idea of how to construct the modes. We will just construct them in the key in relation to the C major scale. The Lydian Mode: The forth mode of the major scale is the Lydian Mode. It follows this pattern: 1 2 3 #4 5 6 7 8 You may notice that this one is actually quite similar to the major scale, and has only on altered note. Now, the C Ionian, D Dorian, and E Phrygian modes all have relation. Therefore, following the pattern, we would have to construct an F Lydian Mode! So, lets take the F major scale: F G A Bb C D E F And sharpen the fourth note: F G A B C D E F And as you can see, the F Lydian Mode also follows our pattern. It has the same notes as the C major scale, but instead starts and end on F. It would be played on the guitar like this:
```E||----------------------|------------0----1----||
B||-----------------0----|--1----3--------------||
G||-------0----2---------|----------------------||
D||--3-------------------|----------------------||
A||----------------------|----------------------||
E||----------------------|----------------------||```
So, that's the Lydian mode! The Mixo-Lydian Mode: The fifth mode of the major scale is the Mixo-Lydian mode. It follows this pattern: 1 2 3 4 5 6 b7 8 Looking at this, we can determine that the Mixo-Lydian, much like the Lydian, only has one note that differs from the standard Major scale. Now, if you have been keeping up with our pattern, you can probably come to the conclusion that we are now going to construct a G Mixo-Lydian Mode. In that case, you are correct! Let's start with the G major scale: G A B C D E F# G And now lets flatten the seventh note: G A B C D E F G And once again, this scale follows our pattern. It has the same notes as the C major scale, and starts and ends on G. It would be played on the guitar like this:
```E||----------------------|-------0----1----3----||
B||------------0----1----|--3-------------------||
G||--0----2--------------|----------------------||
D||----------------------|----------------------||
A||----------------------|----------------------||
E||----------------------|----------------------||```
The Aeolian Mode: Alright, we've almost reached the end, just two more to go. The sixth mode of the Major scale is the Aeolian Mode. It follows this pattern. 1 2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8 As you can see, this mode has three notes the differ from the standard major scale. It has a flattened third, sixth, and seventh note. So, lets use this pattern to construct an A Aeolian Mode. We start with the A major scale: A B C# D E F# G# A And then we would flatten the third, sixth, and seventh notes: A B C D E F G A And there you have it, an A Aeolian Mode. Once again, this scale has the exact same notes as the C major scale, it just starts and ends on A. Another thing you may notice is that the A Aeolian Mode has the exact same notes as the A minor scale. And that's because they are the exact same thing! If you were to construct a B Aeolian mode and a B minor scale they would be the same; as well as the C Aeolian and C minor, and so on. Much like the Ionian Mode is just another name for the Major scale, the Aeolian Mode is just another name for the Minor scale. So, the A Aeolian would be played the exact same way as the A minor scale, like this:
```E||----------------------|----------------------||
B||----------------------|----------------------||
G||----------------------|------------0----2----||
D||-----------------0----|--2----3--------------||
A||--0----2----3---------|----------------------||
E||----------------------|----------------------||```
The Locrian Mode: The seventh and final mode of the major scale is the Locrain Mode. It follows this pattern: 1 b2 b3 4 b5 b6 b7 8 You may notice that this mode is the least similar to the major. All the notes are flattened except the first note and its octave, the eighth, and the fourth. So, lets construct a B Locrian mode. We would start with the B major scale: B C# D# E F# G# A# B And flatten every note but the first, fourth, and eighth: B C D E F G A B So, once again, it has the same notes as the C major scale, it just starts and ends on B. It would be played like this:
```E||----------------------|----------------------||
B||----------------------|-----------------0----||
G||----------------------|-------0----2---------||
D||------------0----2----|--3-------------------||
A||--2----3--------------|----------------------||
E||----------------------|----------------------||```
Some Final Notes: Now, first off all, since my chart in my Basic Chord Theory lessons were such a success, I will do the same for the Major Modes: Ionian (Standard Major): 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 Dorian: 1 2 b3 4 5 6 b7 8 Phrygian: 1 b2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8 Lydian: 1 2 3 #4 5 6 7 8 Mixo-Lydian: 1 2 3 4 5 6 b7 8 Aeolian (Standard Minor): 1 2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8 Locrian: 1 b2 b3 4 b5 b6 b7 8 Also, here is another chart showing you the relationship between the modes, in the key of C: Ionian (Standard Major): C D E F G A B C Dorian: D E F G A B C D Phrygian: E F G A B C D E Lydian: F G A B C D E F Mixo-Lydian: G A B C D E F G Aeolian (Standard Minor): A B C D E F G A Locrian: B C D E F G A B Now, I could give you more facts about modes, but I want to look at the major scale more first, and scale degrees, which I will do on day three of the third week of CPDmusic's Lesson Writing Marathon! But, there is one last thing I want to look at before we go, and that is grouping the modes. Do you remember yesterdays scale classification lesson? Well, lets use that for these modes! Lets first look at the Ionian, Lydian, and Mixo-Lydian Modes: Ionian: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 Lydian: 1 2 3 #4 5 6 7 8 Mixo-Lydian: 1 2 3 4 5 6 b7 8 As you can see, all three of those modes have a natural 1, 3, and 5, and are the only modes to have just that, therefore making them major modes. Now, if we look at the Dorian, Phrygian, and Aeolian modes: Dorian: 1 2 b3 4 5 6 b7 8 Phrygian: 1 b2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8 Aeolian: 1 2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8 Notice how those three modes have natural ones and fives, while they have a flattened third, like the minor chord. Therefore, these modes are minor modes. Now, if we look at the last mode, the Locrian Mode: Locrian: 1 b2 b3 4 b5 b6 b7 8 We see that it has a flattened three and five, like the diminished chord. So, this mode is a diminished mode. Latter, we will reference these with scale degrees, but you don't need to worry about that for now. Just remember this third and final table: Major Modes: Ionian, Lydian, Mixo-Lydian Minor Modes: Dorian, Phrygian, Aeolian Diminished Mode: Locrian Outro: Well, that's all for day 2 of CPDmusic's lesson writing marathon! Remember, if you want to be able to read these lessons THE DAY I write them, go here. Anyways, that's all for todays lesson, andI'll see you again tomorrow! Support CPDmusic's Lesson Writing Marathon By Joining This Group.

### 64 comments sorted by best / new / date

What Colohue said. But how come this gets on the frontpage?
colohoue, good for you that you have a very advanced take on theory, but really who gives a f*** about the specifics. If something sounds good, the play it. I dont care who you are, if all you know is stupid theory and you suck balls at playing guitar, then how does theory make you a better player? I for one do have a solid foundation on modal theory and its "tonal centers" for keys. I play hard rock and metal and I do a lot of sweep picking and slow melodic solos, and of course shredding... BUT..., I personally dont use modes to solo, I play appregios and construct chords off of the 1 3 5 triad and manipulate notes to make a certain mood. Anyways, for all who are struggling with modes, you will figure it out eventually. Just go jam with someone who knows their shit. Peace..
Theory helps you to recognize just what it is that you are doing when you do come to that thing that "sounds good". You then have the tools to recreate this at will instead of fumbling around on the guitar for hours just trying to find that "good sound" again
JohnnyKeybrain wrote: Okay well then if modes do not account for each step in a major scale as I was taught and as all other sources anywhere state, explain to me then how modes work. Also for the substituting the "minor" modes for each chord i was just trying to understand what colohue was trying to say when he said modes are out of key music all together. I was never taught that. I was taught each mode is step in a major scale. So if you were playing the third chord in a C major scale which is E minor, you would then play the E phrygian mode. That is what I have been taught. Every other source I've seen on Modes explains this. Now if there is some other way, please tell me. I'm not being sarcastic...I really want to know.
That sounds like you've mistaken modes for modulations or intervals to me.
JohnnyKeybrain wrote: Now if there is some other way, please tell me. I'm not being sarcastic...I really want to know.
I've posted this link before, I'll do it again. http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/sho... ?t=1042392 If you have more questions, the Musician Talk forum is the place to ask.
chillern wrote: Is this guy on the money? http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/t... o/the_ultimate_guide_to_guitar_chapter_iv_2_scales_-_diatoni c_modes_in_practice.html Colohoue? AleonianWolf?
Yes. I actually read over those articles before they were released because my input was valued by the writer, but there was nothing I wanted to change.
colohoue, good for you that you have a very advanced take on theory, but really who gives a f*** about the specifics. If something sounds good, the play it. I dont care who you are, if all you know is stupid theory and you suck balls at playing guitar, then how does theory make you a better player? I for one do have a solid foundation on modal theory and its "tonal centers" for keys. I play hard rock and metal and I do a lot of sweep picking and slow melodic solos, and of course shredding... BUT..., I personally dont use modes to solo, I play appregios and construct chords off of the 1 3 5 triad and manipulate notes to make a certain mood. Anyways, for all who are struggling with modes, you will figure it out eventually. Just go jam with someone who knows their shit. Peace..
jmart383 wrote: I for one do have a solid foundation on modal theory and its "tonal centers" for keys.
This makes it impossible for me to believe you.
I'm finished with modes. Nothing makes any sense.
jmart383 wrote: colohoue, good for you that you have a very advanced take on theory, but really who gives a f*** about the specifics. If something sounds good, the play it. I dont care who you are, if all you know is stupid theory and you suck balls at playing guitar, then how does theory make you a better player? I for one do have a solid foundation on modal theory and its "tonal centers" for keys. I play hard rock and metal and I do a lot of sweep picking and slow melodic solos, and of course shredding... BUT..., I personally dont use modes to solo , I play appregios and construct chords off of the 1 3 5 triad and manipulate notes to make a certain mood. Anyways, for all who are struggling with modes, you will figure it out eventually. Just go jam with someone who knows their shit. Peace..
-Specifics are pretty important. -Theory makes you a more well rounded musician. -Of course you don't use modes. If you don't understand them or care to, I highly doubt you are using them. -Manipulating notes to create a certain mood is easier if you have some idea of what you're doing. Not just, "Oh, let's see if this note works. Nope, how about this one?" x 10 -No, they won't. Not if they keep getting lessons from sources that don't know what their talking about.
stndrdprcdre wrote: I'm finished with modes. Nothing makes any sense.
Check out ZeGuitarist's lessons. They are the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
stndrdprcdre wrote: I'm finished with modes. Nothing makes any sense.
solidify your understanding of tonal theory first. once your understanding of tonal music is solid, modes just become about the shifting of the intervals. trust me -- when you know your tonal theory and you realize that all you need to do is shift the interval pattern you're going to kick yourself for not realizing it before. it's just that guitarists (musicians in general, yes, but mostly guitarists) see these things like that video of vinnie moore explaining what he thinks are modes that completely destroy the concept of having modes. and then confusion comes of it. and then the guitarists who really have the capacity to understand modes become so frustrated that they just give up on them. so just don't give up. solidify your understanding of tonal theory and let the rest come. and i second everything rockingamer2 said in response to jmart's post. you need to open your mind, dude. the specifics are very important in ANY field. oh, and just because we have an advanced understanding of theory doesn't mean we suck at playing guitar.
My understanding of modes is that the sound of the mode was based around the chord being played. If your playing a C major chord and play notes in A minor or D Dorian, it's going to sound major no matter what notes you land on in that scale. However, if you play a D minor 7 chord, and play notes in C major, it would sound Dorian. But it also helps to know what notes to land on in relation with the chord being played to get the full effect of the mode.
Thank god I understand this. Modes are one of the easiest yet most misunderstood concepts in music
All you guys are going on about tonal centre tonal centre. And sure thats an important part of it. But what the hell are you going to when a borrowed chord is slapped in the middle of a key area? example chord prog: Cma7 Ami7 Dmi7 G7b5 Cma7 I vi ii V* I This appears to be a key area of Cmajor right? So you can play to the tonal centre right? ie Cmajor scale of everything? WRONG. Because the 4th chord in the progression doesn't belong to the key of C. The Root motion and alteration to the fifth leads us to believe that the chord is a borrowed V chord from minor. And thus there is no choice but to play over that chord with it's own scale: Harmonic minor 5 (the fifth mode of harmonic minor)
Okay well then if modes do not account for each step in a major scale as I was taught and as all other sources anywhere state, explain to me then how modes work. Also for the substituting the "minor" modes for each chord i was just trying to understand what colohue was trying to say when he said modes are out of key music all together. I was never taught that. I was taught each mode is step in a major scale. So if you were playing the third chord in a C major scale which is E minor, you would then play the E phrygian mode. That is what I have been taught. Every other source I've seen on Modes explains this. Now if there is some other way, please tell me. I'm not being sarcastic...I really want to know.
KerSkater wrote: My understanding of modes is that the sound of the mode was based around the chord being played. If your playing a C major chord and play notes in A minor or D Dorian, it's going to sound major no matter what notes you land on in that scale. However, if you play a D minor 7 chord, and play notes in C major, it would sound Dorian. But it also helps to know what notes to land on in relation with the chord being played to get the full effect of the mode.
The difference is in the positioning. Playing a D Dorion shape over Dmi7 lets you see where your notes are. If you practice correctly you will be able to know what value each note holds in that shape ( 1 3 5 7 9 11 13 etc) so you can play to the strong notes or the tensions if you want. If you get good enough at seeing interval values you can even forget about scales and play purely to chord tones and tensions (very jazzy sound)
Ibanezbelyeu wrote: All you guys are going on about tonal centre tonal centre. And sure thats an important part of it. But what the hell are you going to when a borrowed chord is slapped in the middle of a key area? example chord prog: Cma7 Ami7 Dmi7 G7b5 Cma7 I vi ii V* I This appears to be a key area of Cmajor right? So you can play to the tonal centre right? ie Cmajor scale of everything? WRONG. Because the 4th chord in the progression doesn't belong to the key of C. The Root motion and alteration to the fifth leads us to believe that the chord is a borrowed V chord from minor. And thus there is no choice but to play over that chord with it's own scale: Harmonic minor 5 (the fifth mode of harmonic minor)
Personally I doubt that progression would sound worthwhile and, even so, what on Earth is your reasoning for only playing one thing over it? There is never a point when you're limited to modes and, even so, this isn't a relevant example.
You aren't ever limited to modes. This is just an example of how they can be used. This progression is more likely to be found in jazz. It was a theoretical example. There are tons of scales to play over it. However you can't deny the pull the chord has to function as V in minor. Match the tonality of the chord with a scale that agrees with it - and Harmonic minor 5 does just that. Or you could play the parent harmonic minor...but positioning in guitar plays a big role. If you can play through the parent and know exactly where your chord tones are then props, do that.
What would you suggest one should play over this progression: This is from Wes Montgomery's West Coast Blues Bb7 Ab7 Bb7 Bmi7 E7 Bbmi7 Eb7
Ibanezbelyeu wrote: You aren't ever limited to modes. This is just an example of how they can be used. This progression is more likely to be found in jazz. It was a theoretical example. There are tons of scales to play over it. However you can't deny the pull the chord has to function as V in minor. Match the tonality of the chord with a scale that agrees with it - and Harmonic minor 5 does just that. Or you could play the parent harmonic minor...but positioning in guitar plays a big role. If you can play through the parent and know exactly where your chord tones are then props, do that.
While you're certainly correct concerning the Harmonic Minor, and you've gone about it the right way, I'm not sure that you'd hold the tonal centre for long in this progression before the resolution went its own way. Due to how much more instable they are, I don't consider there to be any modes outside of the major scale. It keeps me from playing with them. I have enough issue with Locrian. For that progression, I would play in Bb, then make a chromatic modulation for the Bm.
I'm sorry man, I'm not quite following the first part? As for the progression. I'm sure what you are suggesting would hold, however using individual scales or modes over each chord can only open up further opportunities. Mixolydian over every 7 chord for example. I am by no means saying this is the only way to solo, just one approach and I don't see why it should be neglected or deemed "wrong". I have embraced Modes in two lights 1) In a key, they are merely the notes of that key with a reference to one of the scale degrees in particular (Cool, this practically means that modes are irrelevant though) 2) Modes are viewed as their individual scales. These scales are applied over chords that they "fit" over
* instead of - (chords that the fit over) I should have said chords that have corresponding qualities
Ibanezbelyeu wrote: I'm sorry man, I'm not quite following the first part? As for the progression. I'm sure what you are suggesting would hold, however using individual scales or modes over each chord can only open up further opportunities. Mixolydian over every 7 chord for example. I am by no means saying this is the only way to solo, just one approach and I don't see why it should be neglected or deemed "wrong". I have embraced Modes in two lights 1) In a key, they are merely the notes of that key with a reference to one of the scale degrees in particular (Cool, this practically means that modes are irrelevant though) 2) Modes are viewed as their individual scales. These scales are applied over chords that they "fit" over
Neither of those are examples of modal play.
Look dude, instead of telling everyone that this whole lesson is wrong, why don't you contribute something other than telling people that they're wrong? There's this great new thing you could try called "constructive criticism", very progressive stuff.Sure, he didn't go into detail about tonal centers and playing the modes over chords, but he provided a lot of useful information as far as how to build modes correctly given a key. That is hardly useless or confusing information. If anything you should apologize for all the people you probably confused by telling them that this is incorrect information, because it isn't. Look at yourself man, almost everything you've posted is telling people something along the lines of "sorry, that's wrong" with no explanation on how to fix their issue. I don't know what your deal is but don't use musicianship as an excuse to treat people shitty, it makes us all look bad.
By they are examples of how modes can be used. And quite effectively. Why rule out using modes in this way? What is to lose?
check out joe satriani's lessons on modes on youtube.
i would take this lesson (and others like it) for what they are, a way to learn to build the modes (which is very much accurate and the absolute best place to start learning the modes) after-all, you can't USE the modes if you can't build them. This process is the most time consuming and ultimately the most difficult part of learning modes because it requires lots of memorization and ear-training, which once again, those fundamentals have to be in place before you can even attempt to use them, isn't that how you learned the major scale? playing the same scale up and down, up and down, up and down? So I just don't see telling someone they are horribly wrong for saying the best place to start is the beginning. Kind of difficult starting at the back of the instructional manual. It probably should have been mentioned in this lesson as well as in the lesson that I posted on the subjuct that the ear-training part of learning the modes is critical to proper use (i.e. which notes hold the most tension and how they resolve), but hopefully that will come in time. Learn this lesson first!!! This is the starting point!!!
I can,t believe all the INFO that I have learned just in the Arguing on this all the different pos. and all !!! EXELLENT!!!
rockingamer2 wrote: The internet and guitarists that don't know what their talking about spew out a lot of misinformation about modes, and we end up with a ton of guitarists who think they know all about modes when in fact they know very little about modal harmony.
bingo.
JohnnyKeybrain wrote: You are 100% wrong to say modes do not make a Major scale. I am not saying you are wrong for what you are trying to say. If your in C major and you get to the D note, you could play the D dorian, D phrygian, or the D aeolian mode. Same applies for the Major chords using the Major sounding modes.Each mode represents a different chord in a Major scale.Its not debatable its a fact. So in C Majors case.. C-Ionian Mode D-Dorian Mode E-Phrygian Mode F-Lydian Mode G-Mixolydian Mode A-Aeolian Mode B-Locrian mode Those are the Modes that make up the c major scale. You do not have to use those particular modes for each note but you also could and stay in the key of C Major the entire time and you would be fine.
now, see, THIS is wrong. this is not playing modally at all. this is just playing within C major. if you have a ii-V7-I in C major, you do not play D dorian, G mixolydian, and C ionian -- you play C major. period. and i don't know where you're getting this business about substituting the "minor" modes for a minor chord. because all you're doing then (take, for example, D aeolian over a Dm chord in C major) is using an accidental -- a Bb in the key of C major. D aeolian is not even remotely involved, even though the notes within it are present. [quote]JohnnyKeybrain wrote: Modes are what make a Major scale. I'm also pretty sure he knows what hes talking about in that video considering every other person who teaches lessons on modes says the exact same thing as him. Modes are what make up a Major scale. That is a known fact. Read. http://www.guitarstatic.com/modes-of-the... uote] http://www.guitarstatic.com/modes-of-the...
[b] Colohue m : If you do want to learn modes, please just go to the Musician Talk forum. It will help you to no end.
link please? I'm getting annoyed with all these contradicting lessons. Just as I think I understand modes, another lessons comes along and tells me otherwise
I knew Colohue was going to be al over this once you said you were going to do a lesson on modes. All of your other lessons are spectacular, but it seems like everyone gets this concept wrong.
@Colohue I always thought a mode was a scale that corresponds to a diatonic chord, i.e., I=Ionian, ii=Dorian, iii=phrygian etc., so I thought this article was accurate. How would you define modes?
There's no major or minor set of modes. Only one set.
Once again, it makes perfect sense to me- yet there are always those select few repeat offenders who have to throw a spanner in the works by contradicting everything said in the lesson. Said people are the ones who are confusing us little people and preventing us from fully understanding the modes. I for one liked the lesson. Flame me if you will
SilverSpurs616 wrote: Once again, it makes perfect sense to me- yet there are always those select few repeat offenders who have to throw a spanner in the works by contradicting everything said in the lesson. Said people are the ones who are confusing us little people and preventing us from fully understanding the modes. I for one liked the lesson. Flame me if you will
You can like it as much as you like but the information here is still inaccurate and misleading. I would try and explain but I'm sure Colohue will do a better job.
I would also point out that in both this and your "Classifying Scales" lesson you missed out the other major sound in music: Dominant.
You shouldn't be able to post lessons on this stuff until it's looked over by someone with a degree. This would confuse me more then anything if I was to read it a year ago.
It seemed to make sense, but I've read so many lessons on this stuff I am left with no clue after everyone sais it's wrong... Is the end right atleast??? Dorian flat 3rd flat 7th Phrygian flat 2nd 3rd 6th 7th Lydian #4th Mixo-Lydian flat 7th ...etc...??? I will happy if that is right and very confused if wrong lol
SFosterS wrote: It seemed to make sense, but I've read so many lessons on this stuff I am left with no clue after everyone sais it's wrong... Is the end right atleast??? Dorian flat 3rd flat 7th Phrygian flat 2nd 3rd 6th 7th Lydian #4th Mixo-Lydian flat 7th ...etc...??? I will happy if that is right and very confused if wrong lol
The point is that you can't use this information, but it's presented in a way that encourages you to do so. It's a list of modal degrees with no reference to the tonal centre, suggestive play or, more importantly, development of the piece to require modes.
Colohue wrote: No, that's not what modes are. Another wrong lesson on them; they are not scales. Please, can we finally realise this and stop teaching exactly the same lesson without any actual knowledge of the most basic modal facts?
I agree. Thank you, Colohue.
So, how exactly are modes used? To you just take a scale, say, C Maj, (CDEFGAB), and then add the formula on to it? Say I wanted Phrygian, which is (1 b2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8). So would C Maj Phrygian be: C Db Eb F G Ab Bb C? Or would it simply be: E F G A B C D E? Another thing that popped in my head, since Phrygian is the third mode, do you just raise all of the notes three whole tones, then apply the mode to it? Like, it would be: E F# G# A B C# D# E +1 b2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8 = E F G A B C D E Hmm.. It appears I might be understanding these. Colohue, can you verify this for me?
Another thing I just noticed, C Maj up 3 whole tones is simply E Maj
Lord_Hondros wrote: So, how exactly are modes used? To you just take a scale, say, C Maj, (CDEFGAB), and then add the formula on to it? Say I wanted Phrygian, which is (1 b2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8). So would C Maj Phrygian be: C Db Eb F G Ab Bb C? Or would it simply be: E F G A B C D E? Another thing that popped in my head, since Phrygian is the third mode, do you just raise all of the notes three whole tones, then apply the mode to it? Like, it would be: E F# G# A B C# D# E +1 b2 b3 4 5 b6 b7 8 = E F G A B C D E Hmm.. It appears I might be understanding these. Colohue, can you verify this for me?
Congratulations; you've worked out the notes of a mode from this lesson. However, you can't use it. There's nothing here on using it. It's just yet another lesson that explains the formulae, but then tells you that all you have to do is start with a different root. This is wrong. If you do want to learn modes, please just go to the Musician Talk forum. It will help you to no end.
I don't understand what the big confusion with modes is. It's the easiest thing ever to understand. Modes are just different starting points in a major scale. So if your in C major, none of the modes would take you out of that key.Just the different starting positions in that scale.
The thing about lessons like these is that they explain how modes are constructed and how they are related to the major scale. The article is correct in that respect(there might be a flub here or there, but nothing extremely damaging to subject of the article). But what they don't do is explain the use of modes. Sure, you know the scale formula and how it's related to the major scale, but that knowledge is pretty useless unless you know how modes are used and the rules governing their use. Ever hear of modal vamps? Drone note in a chord progression? Tonal center? If you haven't, then you don't really know about modes. The internet and guitarists that don't know what their talking about spew out a lot of misinformation about modes, and we end up with a ton of guitarists who think they know all about modes when in fact they know very little about modal harmony.